Car Tech forum: What's your favorite alternative fuel?

H2 is definitely NOT where it's at, way too much energy expended to make it a viable source.

I own a Prius and the Prius batteries are not more toxic than current non-hybrid car batteries (you know, the ones that start your car and need replacing every few years) and the Prius batteries don't require frequent replacement like most car batteries.

Prius goes a LONG way towards helping the environment with ultra low emissions when the gas motor is on and with conversions that bring the Prius upto a realistic 100 mpg (45 mph electric only operation) and plans to get that to 250 mpg (conversions currently cost about $10K). The Prius also has many other environmental friendly aspects about it, such as regenerative braking system -- 300,000 miles on a Prius without a single brake pad change is common. The gas burning engine is tiny and requires much less oil when performing a service. The toxic battery issue is something GM/FORD companies would love you to believe and run with, but the reality of the Prius's harm to the environment vs. convential autos is in order of magnitudes less harmful. Is the Prius the final answer, hell no, it's a transition vehicle but it is a realistic start in the right direction.

The bottom line is less oil consumption -- listening to Auto Industry folks is like a sheep asking the wolf for directions to a safe place.

Most people are pretty clueless on how just entrenched oil and auto companies are in our life and the real power they have over our government. Oil is NOT cheap and is finite -- as we continue to dump huge volumes of it's waste products into our atmosphere -- most people have no clue where the waste product of burning gasoline goes, they just think it somehow magically dissipates into space (seriously!). They seem to think the atmosphere has some infinite volume -- I guess ignorance is bliss.

But what the human race needs to stop doing, is wasting energy and be smart about energy consumption and how to make the best possible use of energy. The gasoline engine is horribly inefficient where 70% of the energy generate is completely wasted. Do we really need to drive a Hummer to get food/supplies from a store that is <1 mile away? Why is the Ford F350 the best selling vehicle in the US? Basically greedy, self centered, unconcerned, the world revolves around me Americans -- (I'm an American so this is not jealousy). And we wonder why the rest of the world hates Americans -- you could almost argue they are doing so to "Save the planet" (perhaps a little extreme). American's and our society needs to stop being so pig headed about what we deem is our "right". Cause ultimately none of us have any rights as the planet doesn't care about our stupidity and ignorance -- it will resolve itself one way or another - you can confirm this with just about any geologists.

Solar power is free, is getting more efficient as our planet is rapidly heating up thanks to our oil consumption/and waste patterns.

Nobody seems even remotely concerned that by 2050 our average earth temp has been projected to have increased 3.8 degrees -- this alone is enough to wipe out at least 1/2 of all life on this planet (including humans). Sorry, no science to save the day, no magic, and no God(s) either. The ONLY way to resolve this issue is if every one of us becomes aware and responsible.

As of our current situation, Solar should be on every building and home in every country, it's free energy. This is real here and now power source with real technology. Regulations to force home builders to install solar power systems should have be instigated 30 years ago. Use the power to charge your vehicle, have considerably smaller vehicles using materials that are light weight.

Right now our cycle of burn more oil & coal which heats up the atomsphere even more which in turns requires more oil & coal to keep us "cool" and more energy to find water or filter it -- and so the cycle increases to the point where the waste energy is exceeding our ability to use that energy to survive.

Come on folks, lets get real about this, stop pretending all is good and Auto makers and oil companies are "responsible". They're NOT!

Hydrogen is not mined - or grown in fields in Kansas. It is generated using Electricity.

So how is the Electricity used to manufacture the Hydrogen going to be generated ? Hydroelectric ? Not very ecologogical, and most major rivers are already dammed. Wind ? Not too pratical, and Teddy Kennedy hates them. Burn Coal or Oil ? Then what's the point ?

The cheapest way to make Hydrogen is from Natural Gas. For about $350 you can convert any car to run on Natural Gas so what is the point of needing hydrogen? I have seen cars in the 1960 that run both Natural Gas and Gas.

Oh by the way converting Natural Gas to Hydrogen would cost over $8 an equivalent of gasoline today. Converting Hydrogen from water would cost a lot more to produce Hydrogen.

Biodiesel is the best bet for a new fuel. Commpresse air would be the best solution.

Ethanol from corn (and biodiesel from soy beans as well) will be a credible source of fuel for internal combustion engines when the farmers who grow the corn (and soybeans) convert completely to these fuels and abandon fossil fuels for the plowing, planting, cultivation and harvesting of their crops.

The use of ethanol to fuel the distilleries that produce "ethanol from corn for motor fuel" makes even greater sense. It does not have to be delivered. Private enterprise undoubtedly has concluded that there is a better way to fuel the stills.

Also, check out:

http://news-service.stanford.edu/news/2007/april18/ethanol-041807.html

There may be places where ethanol as a fuel will DECREASE air quality. They are predominantly 'blue state' so it the problem is 'insignificant.'

Yep. Thats what I ment. It was late and I goofed.

Although it's slower it is less impacting on the environment, maybe a hybrid of Solar power combined with Hydrogen could be the best solution. I think the direction of Hydrogen power should be now to minimise, or rather eliminate, Hydrogen leakage altogether. I'd be interested to know the projections of how much oil is left in reserve before we will be forced to change to an alternative. At present I believe the oil companies have too much money and are deeply inbedded in politics and vehicle manufacture for there to be a significant change until it is forced upon them. I'm sure they are at the head of the majority of alternative fuel research and will only impliment as a contingency plan once they have no other option.

After doing research on the top five alternative power sources for cars, I've come to the conclusion that a hydrogen starter with an electric motor would be the ideal combination. Both would have the ability to charge each other--almost like perpetual motion but not quite because there would be parts wearing out and maintainance.

Next to that would be a bio-diesel or gasoline starter with an electric motor. In that case, the motor is recharged either by plug-ins, or in the case of the new Ford concept SUV, each time the brakes are used the electric motor is recharged. Unfortunately, when using the Ford's electric motor you cannot drive faster than 25 MPH. To move faster its gasoline motor kicks in.

Ideally, the electric motor is best when it's powered from energy obtained by wind, the sun or ocean waves. Those, along with hydrogen power would have the least polluting energy. Also, the electric motor has virtually no parts to wear out, so would be less expensive to repair.

Interesting idea, food-glorious food,hot sausage and mustard etc..BUT..... Where there is a production of energy, there is also a production of "less desirable" side effects!With a car,it's the exhaust pipe, with a human being much the same thing!Cows produce what is called "mist", and unlike the human equivalent,this "mist" is usable, transformable into energy at its turn!The human being's waste product is,in fact,the only waste product,of an animal nature, which is unusable.Try putting it onto your garden as manure, and watch your plants die!Why not try to find a method of recycling such a waste product, in plentiful supply,producing (as we sometimes have to acknowledge) certain gases.Gas usable as gas?
Incidentally, I didn't beleive my eyes when I saw that Leo filled up at just under 4 dollars!What does he drive,a mini-mini scooter with a tank of around 3-4 litres? That's what he would get here in Europe, where petrol (gasoline) costs between $0,99 and $1.20 THE LITER!!AND - he seems to be complaining!
I have no vehicle any more, couldn't afford to fill the tank, at around 65euros the tank (circa $88.516 at this morning's rate)for 60 LITERS!
There lies a solution, make Gas the same price everywhere in the world, and people WILL walk more, lowering the Health costs as well.This isn't alternative energy, it's using-wisely-what is already available!
(iwmpop)

The pollution problem with lawn mowers in not the 1-quart per hour but the hydrocarbons given off by the damaged grass. The gas is mostly turned into carbon dioxide and water, the poor grass plants expel lots of hydrocarbons until they finally heal.

There are places in the world where human waste is recycled, for its metal content, with the price of gold, and other metals rising as we use them up, you would be amazed at the wealth your are flushing down your toilet.

By the way, if left to sit a year and it starts to bio-degrade it can be used to grow plants. Manure has to sit for an extended period before being applied to crops, the stuff you use on your garden has also been baked. disease would otherwise pass on, if it has the ability to live off a human host

Why not move closer to work? Sure, you probably couldn't find a place that is walking distance to work, stores and other necessary services. But a 52 mile round trip that could be avoided every day would seem to make it worth moving.

get a job closer to home, or move closer to your workplace and then walk.

I live in a fairly large city, and for the last 10 years have not owned a car, that does not say that on rare occasions that I do not make use of them, if leaving the city, I may get a rental, but that is rare. I also walk to my place of employment and walk back and forth to the grocery stores, makes for fresher products.

I agree that society would not survive with out a means to transport our products, but the everyday use of vehicles by most folks is a frivolous pursuit at best.

And before you go to the public transporatation route, in most case a bicycle is faster and costs me less, and as I am in my mid fifties it has the added avantage of keeping me healthier

all the current discussion about alternative energy are about to continue wasting energy at the cost of huge parts of the world, thus excluding them from our lifestyle. we are just facing a period of time that shows us the dramatic cost of such irrational behaviour (9/11, iraq, sudan to name just a few..).
for me its just a lack of intelligence that we can not imagine a high quality life without wasting energy. no one wants to go back up the trees throwing coconuts at each other, but slowing down and enjoying nature is a pleasure that does not cost a bit (except the profit of some industry..;-))
so again thanks for adressing the real problem...

Walking is the "forgotten mode of transportation." It should be everyones alternate fuel for reasons that are too obvious to mention. How many times do you crank up the car for a journey of a half mile or so? Maybe everybody can't afford a new Toyota, but we all have shoes and most of us should use them more often.

Daniel & Frank,

Glad you two brought in other ideas. My car is a Toyota Sienna van, and I'm pulling a utility trailer with it from Pensylvania to Tennessee to bring back my new Rhoades Car. My model is a two passenger quadracycle with 36 speed transmissions for each pedal person, and since I am old (er than I used to be) and have a bad knee and can no longer pedal my mountain bike up the hills here , I ordered it with the 750 watt helper motor. I'll still use the van for family and trips, but hope to use the human-electric hybrid for my local travel, and for one-on-one time with my children & grandchildren. If they like it, maybe they might even convience my wife to try it!

Larry from Pittsburgh