Home audio & video forum: How can I properly surge protect my home theater equipment?

in lieu of an inspection by electrician perhaps i can come up with a temporary solution. the kitchen is not far off and the outlets in there are grounded. would it serve any good to run an extension from the kitchen to the location of my gear? i've read that if the ground run is more than 10' or if there are bends or all these other scenarios it defeats the purpose, so maybe it would be futile to attempt. i've never had a lightning strike take out any of my equipment, but i just sunk a wad of cash into a gigantic tv and it's the first time i've ever really been concerned.

My skin's thicker than yours, so I'll ignore your other reply to me and still chime in.

Obvioiusly if you feel there's a risk to frying your equipment, then of course either the kitchen or bathroom grounded outlets are your only option until you can either move or, properly ground your building/apartment.

Next time do your research before bringing in all the expensive gear(!)

Hmm, there's a little bit of a typo here, but are you saying that: "Electrical codes have mandated that ... OLDER homes must be wired with the kitchen and bathrooms [having] GFI outlets which requires a good ground at those locations"? That's not true. NEWER homes are required to have GFI outlets. No one is required to rewire their old homes to meet current electrical codes.

The OP asked about protecting electronics. No GFCI protects hardware (transistor protection). A GFCI is required by code (human protection). Only for new construction or with new wiring. Grandfathering is why many kitchens and bathrooms do not have GFCIs.

Safety ground is for human safety. Does not do transistor safety (for a long list of electrical reasons starting with wire impedance). Human safety is achieved by the third receptacle prong (safety ground) or by installing a GFCI. Surge protection (transistor safety) has always been created by solutons where wires enter the building. Transistor safety (what the OP asked about) and human safety are completely different even if both do share a few connections.

Code only discusses wiring to meet human safety; does not define transistor safety.

"A transistor protected by a fast-acting fuse will protect the fuse by blowing first."

This seems to be quite true and later you find the more expensive device will always blow before the next one. That is, we need to install fuses that cost more than the parts to correct this.
Bob

> "A transistor protected by a fast-acting fuse will protect the fuse by blowing first."

Incorrect due to so many numbers. Some numbers are obvious even to layman.

For example, if three miles of sky cannot stop a surge, then why would millimeters inside a fuse stop it? Obviously, it won't. Demonstated is a common problem with surge protection. Many recommend by ignoring obvious facts and numbers. Also explains why advertising so easily manipulates so many.

2) What happens when a fuse blows during a surge? Voltage increases as necessary so that the current continues to flow (a first semester engineering concept called current source). All fuses have a number for that voltage (ie 250 volts). How does a 250 volt fuse stop a surge that, to do damage, must be thousands of volts? Obviously, a fuse does not do protection.

3) Another number: a surge is done in microseconds. Fuses take anywhere from milliseconds to hours to trip. A number obtained from fuse datasheets. Maybe 300 consecutive surges would pass through a fuse before it even thought about blowing. Even a millisecond fuse would not stop the typically destrutive (microseconds) surge.

Any protector device that claims to stop or absorb destructive surges is (and should be obvious to every layman) best called a scam.

A fuse, circuit breaker, or GFCI is for 'human safety'. It blows after damage has occured. So that a resulting house fire cannot occur. It blows only for 'human safety'.

GFCI or surge strip would protect by stopping or absorbing a surge. If so, then the number that says so is posted. Numbers say otherwise. Many who make recommendations avoid and do not post numbers.

How does anyone resolve conflcting statements? One based in reality includes perspective - the numbers. The most damning number: if three miles of sky cannot stop or absorb it, then how will 2 centimeter parts (or fuses) stop it? Protecting appliances for well over 100 years has never been about stopping or blocking a surge. Protection has always been found in a fundamental (and numerical) question: where do hundreds of thousands of joules harmlessly dissiapte?

Those numbers also say why safety (equipment) ground is irrelevant to the OP's request.

Many points of view and back and forth but the bottom lines are easy to spot. Sadly I think the OP has reached their limits on what they can do.

Part of a design I worked on was to protect a cellular base station. It was pretty easy since we all knew that nothing we could do would work in all cases. We called it "the hand of God" and then moved to balancing between costs and what we could do. No one on that team would take a position that it could be protected, but we could do better.
Bob

i appreciate the response, but unfortunately it was of little help. i know the outlets are not grounded because there are only two conductors inside. yes my building is up to code, as the kitchen and bathroom outlets are grounded. and my only worry here is my ht gear, thus the reason for my question in the first place. thank you, but in the future maybe you should focus on answering questions, not asking.

So it's proper and encouraged that responders ask questions. Once in a while a new member misunderstands the concept of discussion forums and lashes out like this.

To protect an old 2 wire system is going to be hard to accomplish and the best solution may be to upgrade to the current (at least in the USA/Canada countries) 3 wire grounded system since without that you could inadvertently fry a bunch of gear by swapping the hot and neutral.

It's happened and the owner lashes out at the makers for allowing them to use 2 wire plugs. Go figure why this lesson has to be learned the hard way.
Bob

i understand the concept of a discussion forum, chief. what i do not understand is why someone would waste time responding if there was no help offered. i'm not interested in a discussion of whether my building is up to code. i was simply asking if there is a way to protect gear on an ungrounded circuit. obviously there are few to no solutions. i don't know everything and was hoping someone would have a suggestion that didn't involve rewiring my apartment. sorry for "lashing out" but it seems no one reads the question before replying.

There is no good cure without a good wiring system. Your gear, your choice.
Bob

FWIW, I've read some of your posts/threads here (and elsewhere) regarding this topic. Very helpful stuff.

The only place where you hit a brick wall is the real world, dealing with landlords in general. I know very few (if any) willing to take on what you describe, unless it involves very high end rental properties or something that involves life or death changes that are pressing in a unit. Similarly, a meter reader won't be doing any sort of home/apartment modification, unless the building has had issues. Otherwise, your suggestions are spot-on.

A girl who reads the meter (or a lineman) is the only one who will make that change. She simply removes the meter, plugs in a 'whole house' protector. And then plugs your meter into that protector. Routine. Simple. And implemented almost as fast as it takes to process the paperwork. No one else can do it. And the landlord has no say.

I too have seen the meter readers go back to the truck to swap out a meter. They are more capable than some folk think.
Bob

Sure, the meter readers/linemen are physically capable/trained to make such changes, but I will repeat, unless there's a safety issue involved, getting large monopolies such as ComEd (etc.) to act proactively like this on behalf of a landlord is not easy. The landlord/properly owner may have a say in the matter depending on which municipality is involved/local ordinances. We are treading in legal territory here.

...the discussion is not about a privately owned home, it's a rental apartment. The OP does not own the unit so he doesn't make such changes without permission as you've suggested.

We've already done this dance. Keep in mind that a GFCI won't protect the equipment if, in the case of the OP, he 's working with an older 2 wire system like you see in many older/unimproved apartments. There's no shortcut around re-wiring with a proper 3-wire, properly grounded circuit back to the panel.