Speakeasy forum: I don't know why we are arguing about the NRA

who weren't able to keep track of the guns they were personally responsible for in Fast & Furious not to mention one agent's own personal weapon showing up at a drug murder two weeks ago, do you blame the NRA for not having a lot of confidence in that agency?

how well the government has run Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, US Postal Service, FHA, Fannie/Freddie, Student Loans, bailouts, and even their new 'baby' Obamacare...........et al, yeah, I guess you can say they aren't trustworthy with taxpayer money. And that goes for both parties over many years. But at least the Republicans/Conservatives have figured out that we have a spending problem and a government that's too big not to mention arrogant.

many Reps actually in Congress during the first 4 years didn't......but a good majority of the spending increased during the second half when Dems ran both Houses, please don't forget, so it just continued on and got worse. Plus, the last two years of the first four were getting the war in Afghanistan under way and then Iraq.........and then Katrina hit........

not have stimulus money we couldn't afford to the tune of nearly $1T, Josh. You can't have it both ways. That stimulus money was a joke and didn't need to be spent at all; no more than having the Feds continue after four years to print money like it has been which has devalued our dollar so much that it's only worth about 65 cents now, and if fact, Bernake announced he was doing it again just a month ago. When Bush spent on wars, he was been vilified for it.....when BO spends trillions on idiotic companies that fold after a few months (some never even opened up or sold a thing) and joked on camera that 'shovel ready jobs weren't shovel ready after all, you can't praise his decisions enough.

you're dreaming.........GM still owes about $40B........and the stock 'we' own is being (if not already) sold off at a loss.

As for the stimulus, I didn't mention the auto bailout.......even though Bush 'set it up' as you said, it was for far less than what the Union loving BO actually shelled out.

Where do you get the 20000 jobs? I know a lot of dealerships closed and the number of models were reduced (which would have meant some union jobs lost).

Diana

How many would have been out of work without the bailout with two of the big three closing down?

Diana

maybe the motto of gun owners when ATF shows up is "shoot first".

doesn't have to answer to the USA Voter because it has administrative immunity which is even more powerful than the NRA's lobbyists?

Are you talking about the vote for Kerry as Sec of State? I know they won't let him come up for a vote until after Hillary testifies as the CURRENT Sec of State over Benghazi. As for the Director of the ATF.......nobody has been held accountable (they all still have their jobs, they just got shuffled around......like what happened with the four who supposedly 'resigned' over Benghazi......and the AG, even though he's been held in contempt of Congress, there is NO resolution to F&F because of the Administration. Much like what might end up happening with Benghazi. If there is no accountability in the ATF, they don't need a director, do they?

that will need charging and prosecution when we get an administration in there which will actually uphold justice.

that could, by itself, have prevented a single death in any of these recent massacres. Laws only work when they are enforceable and people adhere to them. Crimes will cease when people don't wish to commit them.

.....that recent events will create a strong enough backlash against the NRA to finally see something done about all this. Gun registration, at the very least, would be a big step.

.....every time they get arrested for possessing an illegal gun.

Registration provides a database of every legal gun and who owns it. I fail to see the problem with that, or how a registered gun is any less protection than an unregistered one. And don't give me that "registration is infringement" or "I don't want the government knowing what I have" BS.

.....that was directed at you personally. The NRA just reiterated its position that registration and background checks are not OK with them. Their paranoia about the evil government coming to take all their precious guns away should not be everyone else's problem. The loopholes that allowed the kids at Columbine to get their weapons have STILL not been closed in most states, and the NRA has even tried to claim those loopholes don't exist, in an effort to prevent further action on them.

I remember one SE member (you can guess who) once taking the position that if there wasn't a gun store within walking distance of his house, his 2nd Amendment rights were being infringed upon. I asked him if it isn't an infringement if someone wants a gun but can't afford one. Should the government be required to make sure nobody's "right" is denied just on account of insufficient funds? You can guess what the answer was.