Computer help forum: Computer Turning Off

If you head over to the Event Viewer, (Control Panel > Administrative Tools > Event Viewer), wait for it to load all messages, then expand the Windows entry, then look at events for last night under System (and you might as well look under Applications as well).

Are there any warning or critical messages for last night?

Mark

If so, there are varying thoughts on this. If it shuts down when no one is around, there could be a number of reasons. A surge protector isn't the same as a UPS and a momentary power surge or dropout that happens while you're sleeping is something your computer will know that you may have no awareness of. The symptom you noted with the surge protector might be it's normal operation and needing to unplug things to get a PC to restart is something that can happen but doesn't mean the hard drive or other component is necessarily bad. You might invest in a UPS instead of a simple surge protector. You could also look at the event log for clues to see if the OS caused the shutdown. Things that happen only one time aren't to fret about, IMO. Just make a mental note and keep an eye on it. Consider a UPS if you want to leave the PC on 24/7, however.

I am at work now and will look at the event log when I get home. I do leave my computer on all the time and it has never been a problem. I did not know there was a difference between a UPS and a surge protector. Can you tell me what I need to get in a UPS? I am not familiar with the UPS.

and what I do. A UPS allows more protection than an some power strip with surge protection circuitry. Think of a surge protector as some sort of body armor that can absorb only so many bullets before it can no longer protect. Surge protectors are designed to absorb damaging electrical jolts by taking the damage themselves. They weaken over time and you never know how much life they have left. As already stated, the are strongly hyped but almost useless. A UPS is better but not foolproof either. What a UPS can do is keep your PC running during short power outages as well as absorb some surges. One idea behind UPS protection was its potential to prevent data corruption when disk writes were in progress and the power went out. A UPS has an internal battery and circuity that can switch to battery power very quickly such to prevent your PC from shutting down unexpectedly. The battery power is limited to usually a few minutes but this is enough for most circumstances. A UPS is still not reliable enough protection from everything and it's just as vulnerable to lightning strikes as anything else you may have plugged into an outlet.

Here's what I do...and maybe I'm a bit paranoid. I have UPS protection for my PCs and network components such as router, switch WiFi AP, etc. I still turn off and unplug devices if I'll be gone for extended periods or when storms are present. I also disconnect my incoming broadband coax from the modem when an electrical storm approaches or if I go on vacation for a few days. I turn my PC off at night or if I'll be away from the house for a few hours. I don't leave it on continuously but that's my own habit. There are tons of threads and opinions about such habits here. To each his own.

I just home and the event viewer shows 12 errors. None of the errors say Perflib under Source at the top. When I click on each one of those it says something different. One says WMI under source and the other two say Event Log under source. Is there anything in particular I should be looking for? This is too technical for me.

I also went online to find a UPS that says AVR but did not find one. Can you tell me of some places that I could find that type of UPS? Once I get the UPS I'll trash the surge protector. I never knew what you told me about surge protectors. That is good to know. I'm sure my family and friends don't know this either.

Thanks for all the help.

A computer powers on or off only when a power controller makes that decision. Even the CPU cannot execute a single instruction until the power controller permits it.

One of the many power controller functions is a safety lockout. Once triggered, the only way to reset the safety lockout is to disconnect the plug from AC mains. You apparently reset the safety lockout. Few even know that function exists.

Neither a UPS nor power strip is relevant. A UPS has only one function. To provide temporary and 'dirty' power during a blackout. So that unsaved data can be saved.

Meanwhile your computer comes from a more responsible manufacturer. Therefore it has comprehensive hardware diagnostics that can boot before the BIOS tries to load Windows. To confirm hardware is working properly. Best time to execute those diagnostics is long before any problem exists. So that you know how to execute them. And know what a good computer does.

You make it sound way more complicated than it is. The computer cannot turn on unless there is sufficient power to run all components, but there's no chip that makes this decision. Devices either get the power they need to operate or they don't. If you need 20W to run Device A, and there's only 15W available, then Device A simply will not work. A control chip would be way too expensive to design and build for the limited benefit it would offer over simple cutout circuitry not too dissimilar from a circuit breaker you find in the average home.

It would be nice if there were a chip like you describe, at least at first blush... But the only way it could work is if every device connected in the computer had a standby mode where it was powered on just enough to be able to tell this chip how much power it will need. That would end up using quite a bit of power long-term, and again when you factor in the amount of money it would cost to design and manufacture such a chip for such a limited benefit, it wouldn't make good business sense to do it. In this case it's just easier to let physics do the work for you. If there's not enough power, the device doesn't turn on. When it doesn't turn on, then it's up to the person operating the computer to figure out why. They can do that directly themselves, or indirectly by coming to a place like this. In the event that the power coming in is too great, or you try and pull too much power over a specific rail, then the circuit trips and doesn't work until reset. While true few know the exact reason, most people manage to figure out that unplugging the computer for a little bit will make it work again.

Because a simple and standard function sounds too complicated, that proves the controller does not exist? Nonsense. Even the CPU does not execute until its power controller permits it.

You have confused functions in a power supply with other and different functions in a power controller. A power supply provides as much power as required only when its controller tells it to power on. That is basic power supply operation and how all ATX computers worked with the first Pentiums.

Safety lockout explains why the OP's HP would not power up. Disconnecting the power cord reset the safety lockout.

Other functions exist inside a PSU. A supply can even have all leads shorted - and nothing is damaged. Another function maintains rock solid DC voltages even when incandescent bulbs dim to 40% intensity. AC voltage can drop that low and is still more than sufficient. Making AVR also unnecessary. AVR is often promoted by urban myths when existing functions are unknown.

Safety lockout is located in another power 'system' component - a power controller. The OP describes a classic safety lockout. A feature performed by the power controller. And that is reset only by disconnected AC power.

Is there any thing on the Event log that I need to be looking for? The event log is technical for me in that all the Perflib's say something different.

I have been researching UPS with AVR and they all have different VA's and watts. Is there a way for me to tell how much I need? I plan to have my computer, printer, router, modem and phone plugged into it.

I just wonder if you are being blinded by science here. I've read all the posts in your discussion and as a layman I must admit my mind is a little confused myself.

But may I ask, what is the condition of your electric supply where you live? Do you have frequent supply cuts?

Where I am, (UK), I rarely suffer loss of electric supply. I don't say it never happens but the last one must be some 2 years ago now. So for me a UPS would be a waste of time and money and I just use a surge protector strip like you have. I know these might be reviled, but they work for me.

But for you, if you have frequent power cuts then a UPS might be a very good idea. That said, if most power cuts are during the night when you are not using the computer then there is another possibility, Hibernation

Rather that keeping the computer turned on, let it hibernate. This saves all of your work in a file called Hyperfil.sys onto your C drive and then shuts down the computer. No electrical source needed, (unlike Sleep which needs a trickle source until you wake the system up).

With Hibernate, when you turn the system back on in the morning, instead of loading Windows up afresh again, it loads the hyperfil.sys file and restores your system to where it was the night before and is quicker than a normal boot up.

It's just a thought.

About your Event Viewer entries. They are not important if your system otherwise works well. You mentioned "perflib" and these are just performance monitor counters and don't affect your OS. In effect they are orphan entries and those can be prevented from recording in the event viewer if you wished to do that. Options offered in the link below may help;
http://community.spiceworks.com/topic/83712-rediculous-amount-of-perflib-event-1008-errors-in-event-log

But personally I wouldn't bother with it as it is not affecting your system.

I hope that helps.

Mark

Windows finds faults. Works around those faults. And records that anomaly in Event Logs to be addressed later.

Your fault was before the BIOS even executed. If the BIOS could not execute, then it could not load Windows. If Windows cannot load, then nothing can be recorded in Event logs.

You described a hardware anomaly typically not recorded in Event logs.

Your computer is from a more responsible vendor. Comes with comprehensive hardware diagnostics, for free, to identify hardware problems. Sometimes identified before those problems are even seen by or only rarely affect Windows. As stated previously, execute those comprehensive hardware diagnostics to identify any existing problems. And also before problems exist. Details in a previous post.

MarkFlax asked some damning questions. For example, how often do your lights dim to less than 40% intensity? If not, your AC voltage is ideal for electronics. A UPS with AVR does no solution because your computer already has AVR. AVR means major variations in AC voltage cause absolutely no change to voltages inside the computer. You already have that. Why spend so much money to only duplicate what already exists?

Execute comprehensive hardware diagnostics to discover any existing hardware problems, to know how to use them, and to know what a good machine does.