Community Newsletter: Q&A forum: My second hard drive is doing the peek-a-boo thing

I just went thru a similar experience with the built in CD/DVD drive on my Compaq Pressario V2602XT with Window XP Home...somedays it would be there some days not....it finally was not....or it would disappear when you put a disc in.... the fix came down to a Hotfix Update from Microsoft for Media player 11 dated 3-19-2007... I unloaded that fix and the E: drive came back and things work great.... I know it's a strecth but it might be related...I have since told Windows Update not to tell me about that update...

Dave

Your DVD drive sounds like it was improperly installed. Check your connections or take it to someone who knows how it should be connected. The connecting wires may just be loose. As far as removing the update, here is what you do: go to Start/control panel/Add-Remove programs and scroll down to the bottom to find the last update and click remove. Windows will do the rest.

Ok, well. First of all, is the hard drive formatted as NTFS? Also, are the plugs to the hard drive connected properly? The reason is because I've installed second hard drives before and it's worked this way for me. I hope this works for you.

The thing that is puzzling here is the "intermittent" nature of the problem. There are not too many things that can cause that. One possibility is that the drive is bad. But let's assume, for now, that it's not.

Are you certain that you have the drive configured correctly? I'm talking about both the jumpers on the drive (master / slave / cable select) and the cable (using cable select requires a special cable). A related question, is your original drive in the new machine configured correctly? On some drives, "master is master is master", but on other drives, there is a separate setting for "Master with slave" and "Master without slave". This could be further complicated by the matter of cable select on the original drive. So the first thing I'd try is configuring the 1st drive (the drive originally in the computer before you added the new drive) as a "hard" Master (with slave if there is such a setting), and the new drive as a slave, and not using cable select (even if cable select is how the system was originally configured before you added the new drive). [This assumes that the two drives are both IDE drives on the same (primary) channel, with your optical drive on the secondary channel.]

Also, go into the BIOS and make sure that the BIOS has both drives enabled (that could be the entire problem ... there originally was no slave drive (on either primary or secondary channel) and you added a drive but you may never have enabled it in the BIOS.

Actually, as I think about this more, you have failed to provide enough information to really help us nail down the problem. We don't know if the original drive in the new machine was IDE or SATA, if it was IDE, we don't know the configuration of the IDE channels or what devices are in the system, what is on what channel, what is master or slave or cable select, or the kind of cables that you are using (40 or 80 conduct, cable select or standard). These are all of the very issues that you have to address, and that are in some way likely to be capable of solving the problem, but we need more information to suggest, with certainty, how to proceed.

I have a SATA drive (300 Gig) in a home built with 3 IDE HD's (200 Gig, 80 Gig, 250 Gig) and 1 DVD-RW IDE. It is not nor has it ever booted from the SATA drive. In part because the Ghost image didn't work - and I conceded to my computers wish to not use it as a Primary still acknowledge the existence of the other 4 drives.

if there is some prob with the jumper setting it would have shown at all its all or none basis..

but in this case the the drive shows up and disapper again ...
this is generally happening bcoz of the external drive...
as per the windows OS the newly install hard drive firstly shows up ...and it should be working fine.. bcoz the software (OS) is tested for the same.. but the main prob arrives as soon as you put and plug in or and external HDD or flash drive.. the bug activates the newly installed drive and some how hides the older one (just in the explorer) but the third prty software can access it .. means it is still active but just hidden ..

its all bcoz of the bug in the OS ... it can be patched

If you're asking for technical help, please be sure to include all your system info, including operating system, model number, and any other specifics related to the problem. Also please exercise your best judgment when posting in the forums--revealing personal information such as your e-mail address, telephone number, and address is not recommended.

One reason can be that Windows gets mixed up when an external drive is connected. Somehow the operating system determines a drive letter in the start-up process.
Please try the following sequence:
-start up the PC without the external drive. Is the second drive available? And accessable?
-if yes now connect the external drive. What happens now? Are both drive visable and accessible?
If both answers are YES, then go to Disk Management, and assign a new drive letter to the external drive (try Z).
Then restart the PC and see what's happening. If both drives are visable your conflict problem is solved.
If you have to answer no on the questions I really cannot contribute more to the problem solving.
Success!!
Andr from the Netherlands

Wendy; I ran into the same issue. And frankly it's easier and safer to replace your primary hard drive with a new larger capacity hard drive. You can damage your pc going through the steps to install an old, outdated or incompatible hard drive. So, unless you can afford to loose your saved data and likely frag your primary drive. Just buy a new bigger & better drive to play it safe. A new drive can be easily turned into a clone of your old drive with the larger storage space and faster speed. I know you want to make it work with the old drive. But, its a bit like pounding a square peg into a round hole. Installing a two drive system is much easier when your building a pc from scratch. And your manually loading the operating system and individual programs. Sorry if this is not what you wanted to hear. But this is your pc and you're the one whose taking the risk of damage and loss.

A five year old PC drive is fully compatible with everything that's on the market today, and there is no technical reason why a drive shouldn't last ten or even more years. In general, a desktop drive that doesn't fail in the first year of its existence normally lasts a lot longer than the system will - it may be a bit slower than a new drive, but that will be the only "risk". And I too am surprised abut your mention of "damaging your PC" - there is absolutely no risk to the PC when installing a used secondary drive, the worst that can happen is the drive failing.

Dear Wendy: I let someone install a 150 GB Hard Drive in my CPU. It doesn't show anywhere on my monitor. I have to click on My Computer and there it is. I was surprised to see my D:\\ drive gone. The friend made an E:\\in its place for my new hard drive. My D:\\drive changed to F:\\ DVD and my E:\\drive changed to G:\\. I seldom go into any of these drives. I mainly use my C:\\drive. Click your My Computer and look for your new hard drive. I seldom use the new internal hard drive. Keep looking for yours and make a note as to where it is. You might have to get a technician to reinstall it for you. It is there somewhere. Good Luck. X-CEO37

your number one problem is that you have an E machine. I had one of those when I first got into computer then everything went wrong and I was left thinking that it was me who was to stupid to do things right until I was told it was not me it was my E machine. I got rid of it and and now, I use Acer and have 2 Acer Desk Computers and 2 Acer Laptops one for me and one for hubby and we both swear by them and neither of us is that good on computers. If you need to go cheap and not have problems like you do with Emachines go Acer.

Hi Wendy,
Glad to hear you're not intimidated by a computer. Not so glad to hear it's not giving you the respect you deserve. When a computer fails, it should fail and when it works it should work. It's the on and off bit that's frustrating.

I do not know your E-machine so I can't make any model-specific comments, but at 5 years any computer is getting on a bit, and may be developing eccentricities... Also any new item is itself suspect, that's why a warranty is important. That aside..

You can check your system's BIOS. When Windows can't see the disk - does it show in your bios? If it does - you have a Windows problem (and advising on that's beyond me). If it doesn't show - it's a hardware problem, and Windows doens't show it because the hardware can't find it.

An act of desperation you can try: if your drive is set to AUTO in hte BIOS, you might be able to change it to the drive's specific configuration (which is usually detected autiomatically). Or if it is specifically configured, you might change it to AUTO. It may make a difference.

Then I'd check the IDE and power cables are seated properly, and check that when the disk is not recognised, that it is spinning (possible power connector problem). It is also possible your IDE cable itself is acting up. If you have a spare available it may be worth a try.

You can usually hear a drive spinning, but if the computer is loud enough to mask it, you can use a screwdriver as a stethoscope - put the end of the handle against your ear (yes wash it first) and the tip against the drive case. Avoid the circuit board! If you find it is not spinning you may have a weak power connector. You can try a different connector - perhaps the CD drive's connector.

Next - check the original drive's jumper settings. Most drives have master/slave/CableSelect, but some vary. Some older Western Digital drives, for example, have 3 settings - single drive, master with slave, and Slave - as well as CS. If your original drive has a 'single master' setting it needs to be changed to recognise slave properly. You can get the jumper settings from the disk maker's web site.

Most likely, however, the original disk is set to "Cable Select." Cable select is a way of assigning master/slave depending on which connector goes to the drive - end is master, middle is slave. I think. Also, the middle connector is not exactly in the middle - the longer side always goes to the motherboard. (Maybe this isn't always true with custom cables in a name-brand computer.) A Cable Select IDE cable has one of the wires cut. You can't usually see it, but this is very convenient for manufacturers - the disk/CD/DVD etc makers set the jumpers to CS and the system builder just takes the required drive and plugs it in. Nothing to configure, nothing to get wrong, and a few seconds saved. And time is money. (insert maniacal laugh here)

SO as an upgrader, you have to check the existing drive - is it set to master (or single drive) or CS? - and then you have to decide how you want to configure... You can set your drive to CS and connect to middle - and it is recognised as slave. If it is physically inconvenient to connect your new drive to the middle, you may prefer to re-jumper your exisiting drive to master, and jumper your new drive as slave, and then it doesn't matter which connector you plug into which drive. However - you should not have one drive set to CS and the other to slave.

OTHER THINGS YOU CAN DO.

As a diagnostic tool - try disconnecting your CD/DVD and hook that IDE cable to your new drive. If it sees that reliably you know it's not the new drive. If it still plays up - you likely have a dodgy drive.

Instead of having main drive/backup drive on the same cable, put your backup drive on the same cable as the CD/DVD drive. This will likely give you slightly better performance when making backups. Before you do this, make sure the CD's IDE cable is an 80-wire cable or the hard drive will be very slow. Many makers put an 80-wire cable on the hard drive and a 40-wire cable on CD, since the CD is slower and doesn't need the speed an 80 wire cable supports. It saves a few cents. It is easy to see if the 2 cables are the same or different - just look at them. If your CD cable is a 40-wire cable, you can change it to an 80. That will let the disk run fast, and the CD won't care.

Maybe external USB is the best option for a backup drive anyway. Any drive in the case could get fried when the main drive gets fried... power surge, lightning, power supply failure, virus attack... If you unplug it when you're not actually making backups or doing a recovery, you elimiate (minimize) these risks. Of course there is always the risk of dropping an external drive. At 5 years old your computer probably has original USB, limited to a little over 1 MB/second. This makes an external drive painfully slow. You can find a USB2 PCI adapter card that gives you about 48 MB/second transfer online for around $10 (buy, newegg, many places). Offline - expect to pay $30.

Wendy, I can offer a few ideas on the problem. It's difficult to diagnose since you didn't mention which operating system you are using, however... you may have a hardware compatibility problem. Even though every hard drive should be compatible with your PC, that's not the case. Some hard drives don't work as well with specific PCs. Or, there may be a compatiblity issue between your old hard drive and new one, especially if the new hard drive is considerably larger. Also, did you check to make sure your computer could handle the size of the new hard drive? Depending on your hardware and operating system, your computer may not have the capacity to handle a huge new hard drive. You may want to swap and make the old hard drive the slave and the new one set up as the master. This is a huge pain to do but may resolve your problem. If possible, you could also return the new drive and buy a drive with less capacity. A 5 year old computer may not be able to handle a hard drive over 40 mb. The manufacturer should answer that question.

Hope that gives you some ideas.

I am sorry to hear about your difficulties. Why you can see the drive sometimes and not others is difficult to answer, but it may have something to do with whether the external drive is connected or not... Maybe you could try what I suggest below with the external drive connected and then disconnected to see if you can identify any differences.
When managing harddrives, I always find it best to go to Start / Right click My Computer and select Manage and go into Disk Management.
This should show you all available harddrives that the BIOS can see, even if they are un-formatted or un-partitioned.

Once in that area, you can partition, format and generally manage your disks.
I hope this helps.