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MP3 players: Transferring CDs to MP3 vs. WMA vs. OGG ... etc....???

by Zing - 4/9/04 1:22 PM
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Post 31 of 54

Re:Transferring CDs to MP3 vs. WMA vs. OGG ... etc....???

by soemoithurts - 5/8/04 4:12 AM In reply to: Transferring CDs to MP3 vs. WMA vs. OGG ... etc....??? by Zing

I'd stick with a 192-kbit mp3. While there are better file formats out there - WMA, AAC, OGGS, AIFF - for those interested in lossy compression, and - WMA, Apple lossless, SHN, FLAC - if you want lossless.

While I prefer AAC to use with my iPod, it won't play on older macs with iTunes. I wouldn't ever touch WMA because my iPod won't play it, and something encoded in WMA might not play on older versions of media player.

If you are to dare and go with a file format, I'd choose AAC. Apple is the leader in mp3 players right now, and their music store is quite popular which uses a protected version of the AAC format. Also, I don't know anyone that uses Media player as their default mp3 player. I use iTunes, PC and Mac, and the ripping is pretty straight forward, you can even rip into MP3, AAC, AIFF, or Apple lossless audio.

-john

Post 32 of 54

Re:Transferring CDs to MP3 vs. WMA vs. OGG ... etc....???

by instugator - 5/8/04 4:46 AM In reply to: Transferring CDs to MP3 vs. WMA vs. OGG ... etc....??? by Zing

I have done this exact same thing.
1. I encode my CD's in 320kbit .mp3 format (I used a 200G firewire external HD for my storage).
2. I ensured my id3 tags were updated (Older versions of real jukebox did not write the tags properly)
3. I burned the entire collection to CD. (estimate ~ 10 Audio CD= 1 mp3 CD as a rough wag)
4. I converted those same 320kbit files to 128kbit files for distribution to my other computers.
5. I stored my CD Copies in a safe place and 1/year I check them to ensure they remain good.

Post 33 of 54

Re:Transferring CDs to MP3 vs. WMA vs. OGG ... etc....???

by Cardinal Fang - 5/8/04 8:09 AM In reply to: Transferring CDs to MP3 vs. WMA vs. OGG ... etc....??? by Zing

Each to their own I suppose. Personally of the opinion that everyone should use iTunes (there is no better or more intuitive music file manager) and encode AAC format/m4a whatever you want to call it (you'd obviously need an iPod as well) at 128kbps. You'd have to have a dog's hearing to differentiate between 128kbps AAC and 192kbps mp3. As for those of you who do it at 320kpbs - WHY? Waste of h/d space and if you really think you can tell the difference then you're either (a) a liar or (b) a cocker spaniel.

Post 34 of 54

Re:Re:Transferring CDs to MP3 vs. WMA vs. OGG ... etc....???

by tomaras - 5/8/04 12:57 PM In reply to: Re:Transferring CDs to MP3 vs. WMA vs. OGG ... etc....??? by Cardinal Fang

>>>As for those of you who do it at 320kpbs - WHY?<<<

I can give you two good reasons to go with higher bitrates and/or a lossless implemenation.

1. Hard Drives are so cheap today (250GB 7200rmp 8mb cache for $149 from Fry's recently) that you can protect yourself from #2 below.

2. Transcoding errors and losses. If you want to be relatively future proof and also preserve the ability to use your encoded music on a wide variety of devices at varying bit rates you need to watch out. Transcoding or converting a lossy codec to another lossy codec or bitrate can produce really obvious degradation that is much worse than you would have gotten had you encoded at the desired final bitrate from a lossless source.

Who's to say that you may not want to take your 128kbps AAC files and move then to a little wristwatch flash player or a cell phone at some point for whatever reason. My library is encoded in lossless WMA9 and I was so pleased last week because the new iTunes 4.5 player now allows for WMA to AAC conversion and I'm able to convert and share (don't tell) some of my music with my friends who iPods without having to do a double lossy conversion. The converted tracks sound great in AAC.

I feel that encoding lossless in whatever flavor you prefer will save you from having to rethink your decision a year or two from now when things inevitably change. I won't buy music online because none of the online sellers will guarantee the bitrate. If Apple decides in two years to start selling music at 192kbps or in some other bitrate or codec I'd like the guarantee that I can re-download the selections I already purchased at that better sounding rate. Nobody is offering that guarantee which is why I still buy CD's and encode lossless.

Post 35 of 54

Re:Re:Transferring CDs to MP3 vs. WMA vs. OGG ... etc....???

by Art - 5/10/04 11:35 PM In reply to: Re:Transferring CDs to MP3 vs. WMA vs. OGG ... etc....??? by Cardinal Fang

I think whether you can hear the difference or not may depend on the type of music you listen to. If what you are listening to didn't make any difference, then I will agree with you..why waste space?

Post 36 of 54

Re:Transferring CDs to MP3 vs. WMA vs. OGG ... etc....???

by Tim Barnes - 5/8/04 9:29 AM In reply to: Transferring CDs to MP3 vs. WMA vs. OGG ... etc....??? by Zing

Do not use WMA unless you would like to be at Bill's whim also DRM will not allow you to enhance the files (i.e. raise volume level,clean up background noise, ect.). Right now the best is Mp3 for ease of use and no invasive DRM crap. I do have 3 suggestions though. 1 Buy a large exernal HD prerferebly 160 or gretter in size. There's usually one on sale in the range of 80 to 120 dollars. 2 when you encode your music use the highest bitrate. The reason is simple sound quality. 3 Check for updates to the Mp3 codec often (the dll used to encode Mp3s).

Post 37 of 54

Re:Re:Transferring CDs to MP3 vs. WMA vs. OGG ... etc....???

by tomaras - 5/8/04 12:37 PM In reply to: Re:Transferring CDs to MP3 vs. WMA vs. OGG ... etc....??? by Tim Barnes

>>>Do not use WMA unless you would like to be at Bill's whim also DRM will not allow you to enhance the files (i.e. raise volume level,clean up background noise, ect.).<<<

Sorry but that's just not true. DRM is OFF by default when encoding with the WMP. Also, Bill Gates does not work in the Windows Media Group at Microsoft. Windows Media Player 9 actually gives one far more control over rights management issues that the other mainstream encoders and players that I have had experience with.

It would seem that you have not had any direct experience with Windows Media Player 9 or you would not have made your ficticious comments nor added your venemous jab at Bill Gates.

Post 38 of 54

Re:Transferring CDs to .....?.... Iīd go MP3

by agore - 5/10/04 9:54 PM In reply to: Transferring CDs to MP3 vs. WMA vs. OGG ... etc....??? by Zing

Probably, the best solution is MP3 at 192 kb/s (if you can rip at 256 kb/s much better)

Iīve tried this format with different types of music (rock, tango, classical, world music)... and I must say
itīs the best

(Of course, .ogg is great... but itīs a question of compatibility).

Besides I recommend you to use dBPowerAmp or CDex for ripping your songs

PD: Iīm sorry for the "errors" of this message... english it is not my motherīs language

Post 39 of 54

Re: Transferring CDs to MP3 vs. WMA vs. OGG ... etc....???

by trevaaar - 7/11/04 9:35 PM In reply to: Transferring CDs to MP3 vs. WMA vs. OGG ... etc....??? by Zing

There is no perfect format. You should choose based on where you want to play your music and how much music you have.

First off, MP3 is definitely not the best sounding codec available. It performs terribly at low bitrates and averagely at high ones. However, I still use it for one simple reason - compatibility. Almost any portable media player will play it. If you want to use MP3, encode using LAME and use one of the --alt-preset settings. Don't use constant bitrate if you can avoid it. 128kbps is not CD quality. If you want perfect quality don't bother using 320kbps, just use a lossless codec. There are different MP3 decoders out there too, so what program or device you play your MP3 with may change the quality you hear. If you use Winamp, download and install the MAD plugin (it sounds much better than the built-in decoder).

WMA has better quality bit-for-bit than MP3, though claims that it sounds the same at 64kbps as an MP3 at 128kbps are way out of proportion. An MP3 at 128kbps will sound much better. DRM (Digital Rights Management) will disable encrypted files from playing anywhere other than on the computer you encoded on so it's probably best to make sure this is off in WMP's options. I'm not sure if it's on or off by default but I know that the first time you rip a CD with Media Player 9 it asks if you want it enabled or not.

Ogg Vorbis is probably the best format quality-wise, especially at low bitrates. It is completely free and is open source. The problem with Ogg is that it's not widely supported (not many portable players will read it).

I haven't had much experience with AAC, but it is definitely a better quality codec than MP3, it is standardized and is supported by iPods.

If you are a quality fanatic, have lots of hard drive space and don't plan to use a portable player, use a lossless codec. Lossless codecs will reduce the filesize of your audio without removing any audio data (whereas other "lossy" codecs modify the audio data to achieve smaller file sizes), so there is no difference when played from the original source. There won't be much (if any) noticeable difference between a lossless file and a lossy file encoded at a high bitrate, but where a lossy compression format will get an 8:1 compression ratio with good quality, a lossless codec will usually put out a file about half the size of the uncompressed file. There are several lossless codecs (Monkey's Audio - APE, Free Lossless Audio Codec - FLAC, Apple Lossless, WMA Lossless to name a few of the more popular ones) and the main difference between them is hardware and software support rather than file size.

Post 40 of 54

Re: Transferring CDs to MP3 vs. WMA vs. OGG ... etc....???

by - 7/18/04 4:30 AM In reply to: Re: Transferring CDs to MP3 vs. WMA vs. OGG ... etc....??? by trevaaar

<i>"Ogg Vorbis is probably the best format quality-wise, especially at low bitrates."</i>

According to the experts (http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/), Musepack is the best format quality-wise.

Post 41 of 54

Musepack

by trevaaar - 12/25/04 6:50 PM In reply to: Re: Transferring CDs to MP3 vs. WMA vs. OGG ... etc....??? by

While it is true that Musepack is the best lossy codec for higher bitrates, it does not perform so well at lower bitrates. It also has far less support than MP3 or Ogg Vorbis (no portable players can play it that I am aware of, and most media player software on PCs requires special plugins to decode it).

Post 42 of 54

Re: Transferring CDs to MP3 vs. WMA vs. OGG ... etc....???

by mon1215 - 8/9/04 9:27 PM In reply to: Re: Transferring CDs to MP3 vs. WMA vs. OGG ... etc....??? by trevaaar

All my music is WMA, and it is all protected because that was the default and i don't know how to change it, so does that mean that i can't copy my music to an mp3 player? Or would i have to rip all my cd's again?

Post 43 of 54

How to turn off DRM in WMP

by R. Proffitt Moderator - 8/10/04 5:38 AM In reply to: Re: Transferring CDs to MP3 vs. WMA vs. OGG ... etc....??? by mon1215

Type WMP MINI FAQ into http://www.google.com

The first hit is the FAQ. But I am unsure if turning this off will wipe out your collection. Maybe it should happen since it will be lost someday due to DRM anyhow. They didn't get a clean method to move such to a new machine.

For me, DRM = NO SALE.

Bob

Post 44 of 54

Re: How to turn off DRM in WMP

by mon1215 - 8/10/04 7:15 PM In reply to: How to turn off DRM in WMP by R. Proffitt Moderator

is there any sort of program that i can download so that i can rip my cd's to mp3's rather than WAV, because windows immediately copies my cd's as WAV files? Also some of my music is just saved on my computer, if i copied the music to cd and tried to save it again would it still be copy protected even if i disabled the copy protect in WMP?

Post 45 of 54

There are such programs.

by R. Proffitt Moderator - 8/10/04 7:23 PM In reply to: Re: How to turn off DRM in WMP by mon1215

Two noted ones for Windows are...

CDEX and EAC

You choose?

Bob

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