Camcorders: Panasonic PV-GS31 Mini DV
Panasonic PV-GS31 Mini DV
by DADSGETNDOWN - 9/23/09 9:40 PMOkay, I have this Dell Dimension 400 it apparently only has 4 USB 2.0 connectors.
I can connect my Panasonic PV-GS31, which uses mini DV tapes to it, and I want to transfer the video from it, but using Windows Movie maker 2 The option to capture DV is grayed out and un clickable.
And I believe DV or DVI is the raw format of that camcorder right ?.
So what are my options to do this ?
as far as hardware if any ?.
as far as software freeware ?
One more thing
by DADSGETNDOWN - 9/23/09 9:58 PM In reply to: Panasonic PV-GS31 Mini DV by DADSGETNDOWNI forgot to mention, it does have a DV out port, but I don't know if they make a DV to USB which sounds to be silly to me.
I have a DV to DV cable and I think DV to Firwire or IE 1394 whatever it is.
But again this computer only has USB..
I am hoping to transfer using Mini Usb to USB (which is how I can connect it to my computer right now) and use some sort of program to capture it raw. OR ATLEAST better than what I see using Windows Movie Maker 2/ wmv and all that.
MiniDV tape based camcorders
by boya84 - 9/24/09 7:26 PM In reply to: Panasonic PV-GS31 Mini DV by DADSGETNDOWNrequire you to connect the camcorder's DV port to the computer's firewire port. Not USB.
USB-to-firewire cable/converter/adapter/hub things won't work.
Firewire, DV, IEEE1394 and i.LINK are all the same thing. None are USB.
The DV port on the camcorder is always 4-pin (for one side of the firewire cable). What you have not told us is which firewire port your computer has. It could be 4-pin, 6-pin or 9-pin.
If your computer has no firewire (or 1394) port, hopefully it has an available expansion slot so you can add one.
Ah well, I did say
by DADSGETNDOWN - 9/24/09 10:43 PM In reply to: MiniDV tape based camcorders by boya84In the original post, "Okay, I have this Dell Dimension 400 it apparently only has 4 USB 2.0 connectors" (400 should be 4500).
ONLY 4 USB meaning that's it nothing else. But I do have an available pci slot.
I can transfer video using USB, but only as .wmv format, using Windows Movie maker 2 FOR WINXP.
So I was hoping Windows Movie Maker 2 was picky, and a different program might work, for getting atleast something other than .WMV. maybe mpeg, AVI. or DV-AVI.
Actually, it's
by LiquidRushOnline - 10/14/09 8:35 PM In reply to: MiniDV tape based camcorders by boya84Definitely 4 to 6 pins. The ones they sell specifically for the gs31 are 4 for the camera, and 6 pins on the computer end
Actually
by DADSGETNDOWN - 10/15/09 1:10 AM In reply to: Actually, it's by LiquidRushOnlineWhat are you talking about ?..
You can use the Mini usb to USB, to access the SD card, use the camera, use it as a web cam. and transfer video.
The 4 pin DV would be for connecting it via Firewire/ IE 1394, so you can get the Full quality DV Video in DV format.
And also doing all the above..
I guess I might not have understood what you are saying :(=
Guys
by Pepe7 - 10/16/09 10:16 AM In reply to: Actually by DADSGETNDOWNYou *can* use USB on that Panasonic to transfer fully compressed or uncompressed DV format to his Dell PC running windows movie maker (etc.). There's a driver you can download from either Panasonic online, or the CD which came with the camera. Not the best choice of video editor clearly, but it works fine to move over the miniDV footage.
There was actually a thread last year I replied to and boya(?) gave a similar response. He must have forgot 
.
cheers,
Pedro
I have never seen the manufacturer USB driver
by boya84 - 10/16/09 10:33 AM In reply to: Guys by Pepe7transfer high quality DV or HDV format video ever work with any miniDV tape based camcorder. In the standard def format, very highly compressed USB streamed video, yes, but not DV format. The video quality from the USB stream format video is about as good as standard def VOB format video ripped from the finalized DVD from a standard def consumer DVD camcorder using LP recording speed.
If it works for you, cool. At the moment, in my experience, you are about 1 in a hundred (including several Pannys).
Stop throwing out the baby with the bathwater
by Pepe7 - 10/16/09 11:34 AM In reply to: I have never seen the manufacturer USB driver by boya84Hey, it's fine you didn't bother to look at the previous thread where we discussed this topic. That's all well and good, but I can assure you, the Panasonic driver I mentioned works with the vast majority of (if not all) the Panasonic cameras with the USB port like the OP's (been there, done that). A whole bunch include both firewire & USB, mainly to help support the PC market, since as you know they typically (even to this day) don't include firewire ports. I make no claims about the transfer of uncompressed DV footage with any other brands that happen to include a USB port, only the Pannys.
cheers,
Pedro
Like I said, that's cool. Merely sharing my experience.
by boya84 - 10/16/09 12:07 PM In reply to: Stop throwing out the baby with the bathwater by Pepe7Panasonic.com says:
http://www2.panasonic.com/consumer-electronics/support/Cameras-Camcorders/Camcorders.75489
and the Camcorder's support area for MiniDV... there's a question:
"How do I transfer or download video from my DV Camcorder?" and the response from Panasonic is:
"Your DV Camcorder will have DV Output connector that will allow connection to a computer that has firewire/IEEE1394 connections. Depending on the available connection on the computer, you will need either a 4-pin to 4-pin or a 4-pin to 6-pin firewire cable which will provide the connection between the computer and camcorder. If your computer does not have firewire/IEEE1394 connection, then additional hardware will need to be installed. Consult your local electronic store for available options. As for software compatibility, there are a variety of 3rd party editing software available. Consult your local electronic store for software options."
Just in case, the manual and USB driver are located here:
http://www2.panasonic.com/consumer-electronics/support/Cameras-Camcorders/Camcorders/MiniDV-Camcorders/Operating-Instructions/model.PV-GS31.O#ts
There is reference to USB streaming at 320x240 pixel size - nowhere near DV-format video quality. But if you are getting full DV format quality, that is awesome.
I've never seen device-specific firewire drivers. In my experience, device-specific drivers (in this context) are USB devices. I have seen drivers needed/used for firewire ports to be active (but no camcorder drivers).
Personally, I severely curtailed editing on Windows a long time ago so I would not need to deal with this driver nonsense - perhaps things will finally improve with Windows 7.
It's weird
by DADSGETNDOWN - 10/16/09 8:52 PM In reply to: Like I said, that's cool. Merely sharing my experience. by boya84That the site says the USB Driver is for,
(Operating System Windows XP, 2000, ME, and 98SE).
But the manual says Not needed for Windwos XP, I believe the knowledge base or support says the same thing,
I wonder IF I should try using that one on my WINDOWS XP to TRY and get Windows Movie Maker to unlock the DV Transfer mode...
Like I said, right now I can transfer video but ONLY in .wmv format.
I want DV or DV-I, RAW or Uncompressed, untouched.
Maybe a different program than MovieMaker 2.?.
I never used the Video Stream driver either.
Again, I think you threw out the baby ;)
by Pepe7 - 10/17/09 7:31 PM In reply to: Like I said, that's cool. Merely sharing my experience. by boya84Question: In your experience do most consumer electronic manufacturers provide sufficient information on their products online?
I didn't think so.
The USB streaming specified by Panasonic may be an additional feature of that driver/software, but to be honest, I didn't bother playing around with that much on my GS500 since even my older webcam had better performance/resolution. It looks like they simply overlooked the fact that camera has a USB 2.0 port and driver available to get the DV footage imported that way in addition to firewire.
I guess I do not follow your mention of never seeing a device specific firewire driver(?) Why couldn't two chipsets simple exist on the same camera 'board' and each have respective drivers?
well...
by boya84 - 10/17/09 9:26 PM In reply to: Again, I think you threw out the baby ;) by Pepe7"do most consumer electronic manufacturers provide sufficient information on their products online"... yes, from what I need from them, yes.
And I certainly have rarely seen a manufacturer "overlook" an obvious selling feature. And being able to consistently import high quality DV format video from a miniDV tape based camcorder would most certainly be an obvious selling point. I have every confidence that if that were indeed possible, firewire would be dead and all professional grade camcorders that use miniDV tape or DVCPRO HD tape or DVCAM/HDCAM/XDCAM would all be using USB. Including those from Panasonic. But they don't.
USB1 and 2 cannot deal with the streaming speeds required by the importing process that DV/HDV (and the others) use. USB3 looks promising, but is not yet available. My experience agrees with that - and my many years in computer systems development and support understands the technical issues and why it is not technically possible.
"Device specific drivers" are those drivers that are added to a computer system in order to allow interaction with certain specified peripherals. In this case, the firewire protocol is the same in all camcorders with a DV port. The IEEE1394 standard is employed in the camcorders the same way by the camcorder manufacturers. There is nothing to change in the camcorder. And all my miniDV tape camcorders (3 at the moment - there have been others that I no longer have) have both a firewire port and a USB port. I have never loaded a different firewire driver because I used a different camcorder. As long as the firewire driver is correct for the computer's firewire port, the camcorder does not matter when it is connected with the DV port. On the other hand, each time I have attempted transferring high quality video over USB form a miniDV tape based camcorder, all I get is low quality, highly compressed, WMV or AVI files. They are garbage compared to the video transferred over firewire. And each manufacturer - whether Canon, Sony, Panasonic and others each have a different driver for their specific camcorder - this is a "device specific driver". Firewire/IEEE1394/i.LINK/DV is a very different protocol from USB. Neither is "better" than the other - each was made to do a specific function a certain way and they both do a fine job at what they were designed to do. USB is a bursty data communications protocol and good for transferring data like copying files - but not for importing video the way firewire does - firewire is a streaming data communications protocol.
I am truly happy for you that you have had such awesome luck with the USB video transfer. Most have not.
reply
by Pepe7 - 10/19/09 8:59 AM In reply to: well... by boya84You've never encountered a poorly written/constructed user manual for a piece of consumer electronic(?) I'm certain you have.
The assumption that the omission of a particular feature would seriously affect sales numbers and/or revenue seems a little premature. Neither you or I can go there w/o more data, obviously.
Instead of asserting something 'is not technically possible' (something you haven't even tried personally with the actual model number/equipment in question), wouldn't it make more sense for someone with your particular skill set to seek out a second opinion(?)
Please don't make stuff up.
by boya84 - 10/19/09 9:49 AM In reply to: reply by Pepe7I never said I've "never encountered a poorly written/constructed user manual for a piece of consumer electronic". How dare you insinuate otherwise.
USB has been part of miniDV tape based digital camcorders for a long time. It does fine with compressed streaming - but does not do high quality DV. If you think it does - or you are convinced that is what you are getting - I have said before and I repeat - God for you. I am happy for you. Great. Cool. Yay. USB connectivity is not a new capability and to think otherwise is invalid.
How do YOU know which Panasonic miniDV camcorder models have been connected to my computing infrastructure? Oh wait - you have no way to know. And I have no need to prove otherwise.
I answered the original post supported by years of experience and manufacturer supplied documentation - which you have not done. Like I said, it does not matter. This started as a response to the original poster's question. You have tried to change that. This is not a technology competition where anyone is trying to make USB or firewire somehow "better". This is for getting the best quality video from a miniDV tape based camcorder into a computer.
And you can try to bait me all you want - I won't bite anymore. Your cliches, putting words in other's mouths and lack of actually contributing useful information to help the original poster's question has grown old and tiresome.
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