Community Newsletter: Q&A: Finding compatible memory and a new hard drive for an older PC
- 10/17/08 4:33 PM
How Do I Upgrade An Old Computer
by JCipo - 10/12/08 7:11 PM In reply to: Finding compatible memory and a new hard drive for an older PC by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
The question is not how but WHY? Computers have never been cheaper. There are many places who will even build a computer for you. I have two computers that are a year apart. I know a lot about computers (30 years of designing systems and writing software) and even though both use Vista, it's like day and night in performance. Take your old machine and give it to charity. Buy a new one (a warranty might also be helpfull) and relax for the next two to three years.
P.S. Guess what is the difference between a new car and a classic 1960's car. You'll have up to 10 years of carefree driving with the new car. With the classic car, you'll spend a fortune to fix it up and you'll still have an old car that could break down at any time! Now substitute the word computer for car.
JCipo
finding compatible memory and new hard drive for PC
by davidaharon - 10/12/08 9:35 PM In reply to: Finding compatible memory and a new hard drive for an older PC by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
Assuming that the you are adding more RAM, then you must match the type of RAM already there
the other way to go is to put in all new matched RAM types as to Same Speed and type that can be used with that machine ...
Because Ram is inexpensive I recommend you Maximize the Ram to whatever your system allows. it is better to have more Ram rather than the minimum ...
With respect to hard drives consider the maximumn size of Hard drive you can put on with the hardare you have ... if the older Hard drive works you might consider to use it as a slave D: drive after placing data files on new drive. once that is done one should copy all the data files to C: and format D: and copy data files back to D:
Simple
by kpinvt - 10/12/08 10:03 PM In reply to: Finding compatible memory and a new hard drive for an older PC by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
The easiest thing to do is take the ram out of the computer (Don't forget to ground yourself on the case) and see what the sticker says on it - e.g. DDR 333 (PC 2700) - then head on over to http://www.newegg.com/Store/SubCategory.aspx?SubCategory=147&name=Desktop-Memory and find the corresponding type of ram through that.
On the matter of the hard drive just stick with IDE it's all backwards compatible so there are no worries for you there.
-Jon
P.S. - If this computer happens to be running RDRAM be prepared to put down BIG bucks for a small upgrade, but that's not all that likely.
P.P.S. - I recommend Corsair, they have never let me down, and the warranty is insane.
To find memory
by norrburn - 10/12/08 10:32 PM In reply to: Finding compatible memory and a new hard drive for an older PC by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
Download Cpu-z, unzip it and run, and you will see what kind of memory you have. Soory have nothing about older harddrives.
burn
Compatible memory
by cassidy2 - 10/13/08 5:33 AM In reply to: Finding compatible memory and a new hard drive for an older PC by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
http://www.crucial.com/
If you go to the above listed site, you can enter the information on your computer model, and Crucial will tell you what memory you need.
I just replaced 512gb on my Windows XP with 2gb from Crucial and it is working great.
cassi
Compatible Memory
by mtsmith - 10/19/08 8:13 PM In reply to: Compatible memory by cassidy2Thank you that really was fast and accurate,It told me everything I needed to find out and it was free !
Unreadable HD
by Noreast - 10/13/08 7:37 AM In reply to: Finding compatible memory and a new hard drive for an older PC by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
Mine experience with a failing drive is not very technical: I used an air can and froze the HD on and on until I could get my data back.
Finding compatible memory and a new hard drive for an older
by bernerayltd - 10/13/08 10:02 AM In reply to: Finding compatible memory and a new hard drive for an older PC by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
Hi Dan C.
To answer part one of your question the easiest and most simple solution would be to click on the following site: http://www.crucial.com/
You can use crucial to scan your computer and avise exactly what is required.
Dan S
Memory and hard drive compatibility
by villanim - 10/13/08 10:44 AM In reply to: Finding compatible memory and a new hard drive for an older PC by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
The easiest and simplest way to determine what type of memory your computer supports, is to fire up your web browser and point it to www.crucial.com. There will be a button at the top of the page labeled Scan My System. Click it, and it will tell what type of memory your system takes, as well as list the available choices and prices (Crucial is a memory manufacturer, you need not purchase from them, but they are very reliable). As far as hard drives, IDE never surpassed SCSI in speed, just in capacity and are much cheaper in price. SATA hard drives use a different connector than IDE, it is a much slimmer cable along the line of a CD audio cable, and uses a different power connector also. They are not backward compatible with IDE, although there are adapters being sold to retrofit them with an IDE controller. NCQ needs to be supported in your computers BIOS (it is called AHCI) AHCI (NCQ) is not supported natively in Windows XP (Vista does support it) and you will have to provide a floppy disk with the drivers on installation of XP (cannot be activated after XP is installed without blue screening your system). If you install VIsta in IDE mode than decide to turn on AHCI (NCQ) later, however, it will also bluescreen. NCQ can actually hurt performance in some situations, but there have been some online reports of chipsets performing poorly unless AHCI is enabled AHCI (NCQ)is only supported by Intel and ATI and not by Nvidia by the way. IF you wish to use SATA drives, you will need to upgrade your motherboard, which will also lead to a memory, CPU and power supply upgrade as well. Last point is, invest in backup, as you can only count on a physical hard drive lasting from 3 to 5 years today.
Hi Dan, I have some good ideals.
by ozzy1122335 - 10/13/08 8:35 PM In reply to: Finding compatible memory and a new hard drive for an older PC by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
Hi Dan, RAM is tricky to know exactly what type or what the mother board can handle. The hard drive is a bit easier to know since it is running a Windows XP.
For the RAM, you would have to shut down your computer, and unplug your power cord from the computer. And then move it to a table to unscrew the outer case.
Take out the RAM by pressing the tabs out wards, and lift it. Do Not Touch the gold part and try to carry it by the edges.
On the front of the RAM their should be a sticker. It would say the manufacture and the type of RAM.
I.E. my spare RAM says 1 GB 2Rx8 PC2 5300 u-555-12
This means it is 1 GB Memory, and it is a DDR 2 RAM, with 5300 Speed. It should say something similar to this.
Here is another example, PC 3200U-303300
512 MB DDR 400 MHz
PC 3200U is the speed or 400MHz. is what it means, the DDR is what kind of RAM
Both above are 340-Pin
Here is a DIM RAM Example, Slower then DDR and is used with Windows 95 B or newer OS. PC 100-322-620
PC 100 Speed.
Almost always the first number is the Speed, then or the socket number. Almost all RAM doesn’t say the Memory amount, or the socket. But you can check out the comparisons to the RAM you have on www.newegg.com and are usually cheaper on New Egg so there is the website.
For the Hard Disk, if it is using a Gray thick cable and it says IDEE somewhere on there then it will be an IDE Disk Drive. If it has a fairly thin connection cable then it would probably be SATA.
If it is older and probably it is, and has a CPU Speed of 1.2 or slower, it may be wise to bye a new one. If you feel comfortable to build your own you can use some parts off your current computer like your Optical Drives (CD/DVD Drives, Card Readers, est.), and save yourself money buying a new computer. For a Hard Disk I recommend using a SATA for a CPU with multiple cores. I built a computer for $572.86 including shipping and taxes from New Egg. It is an AMD Phenom 9850 the second to the top o the line CPU from AMD, and I have 4 GB DDR 2 RAM, and a fairly cheep Motherboard. And a 250 GB SATA Hard Disk. And Case and 580 Watt power supply. But when you build your own you want to reed all reviews from other customers on the parts you put in there and the Mother Board has to support the CPU and SPU Socket size. If you want to build an Intel computer it is cheaper to buy prebuilt.
My computer if was built by a computer manufacture I would of paid $1200 plus for mine. I saved $800 easily. So it may be worth wile to build you a new computer.
If your computer is slow and, cluttered, it may be wise to reinstall windows xp on your computer. You can find Windows XP CD Pretty cheap now, so this may be an option. If you’re into gaming it wise to build a better computer with what you use it for, and if you have games that run on windows xp try windows vista home premium. But it is recommended to have at least 2 GB DDR2 RAM and a CPU of 2.8 GHz.
memory
by col7y249 - 10/14/08 6:27 AM In reply to: Finding compatible memory and a new hard drive for an older PC by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
when looking for new memory it is best to get the memory that is all ready in the PC and take it to the computer shop and buy the same stuff
Older PC Memory and Hard Drive Upgrades
by DrMicro - 10/14/08 8:33 AM In reply to: Finding compatible memory and a new hard drive for an older PC by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
Dan,
There are two or three ways you can get the right memory for your PC, one of which involves opening the case, the other two do not. If you know the brand and model number of your motherboard (even though you don't have a manual), you can use a memory configurator program offered by many memory manufacturers, vendors and resellers. Google "[motherboard name and model] memory upgrade" and go to just about any link on the first page of results. Most sites will tell you what kind of memory your motherboard takes, how many slots and how much memory each slot or the entire motherboard will support, as well as any extra information, such as whether your motherboard supports dual-channel (memory installed in pairs) or not.
You can also download and run a free program called CPU-Z, available from many file download sites or directly from the author's site: http://www.cpuid.com/cpuz.php. CPU-Z can be run as a stand-alone program from a floppy or a flash drive and will identify your motherboard and memory for you. For the type of memory you will want to buy, you will want to look at the tab labled "SPD".
I highly recommend either of the previous two methods, as neither of them involve opening up your case. The third method is to physically examine the memory you currently have. Many (but not all) memory modules have a sticker-type label which often will identify the memory manufacturer, type, speed and capacity. To do this, you must open your case (shut the PC down, pull the power cord and ground yourself to reduce the possibility of static discharge). If you know what your memory looks like and how to remove and insert memory, proceed. If not, stop right there and go back to the previous two methods and take your PC to a reputable PC repair shop and have them upgrade the memory for you.
For the flavor of XP you likely have, the most memory you could possibly use is 4Gb, although you will only be able to use approximately 3.2Gb, and 4Gb is probably overkill anyway. In most cases, 2Gb is plenty. I'm assuming your motherboard is fairly stock and standard, so do not yield to the temptation to buy "premium" or "performance" memory. Standard (so-called "value RAM") will be sufficient and will not make a big hole in your pocket.
Now on to the second part of your question. First, a little discussion. IDE drives (the kind you most likely have now) topped out at 133Mbps (megabits per second), though the majority are 100Mbps at 7200RPM. For the purposes of this discussion, we'll assume that IDE and EIDE are the same. IDE drives NEVER exceeded the speed of SCSI drives, as SCSI drives operate at 10,000 or 15,000 rpm. For the majority of us in the peanut gallery, SATA and SATA-II offered performance somewhat on a par with SCSI without the requirement for SCSI controllers and the high cost of SCSI drives. Briefly, SATA (also called SATA-I or SATA 150) have a rated speed of 150Mbps, while SATA-II (also called SATA 300) are rated at 300Mbps. In order for you to be able to use SATA drives (of either variety), your motherboard must support SATA. If not, your only option is to buy and install a separate SATA PCI controller card. If your motherboard does not natively support SATA, I would not recommend installing a controller card or upgrading to SATA. When this old PC finally dies or is retired to the guest room, any new PC you buy nowadays will already have full SATA-II support.
A last thought on SATA. If your older motherboard does support SATA, it may only support SATA-I (SATA 150), in which case, any SATA-II drive you buy must have its jumper set to limit the drive to 150Mbps operation.
If you're planning on adding a second drive for storage, you will need to ensure your motherbord has an available IDE channel and connector. Most older motherboards came with two IDE connectors on the motherbord and support for a total of four IDE devices (two per channel). Depending on how your PC was assembled, your current hard drive is most likely installed as the Primary device on the first IDE channel, with your optical drive installed either as a Secondary (Slave) on the same channel (same cable), or as the primary device on the second IDE channel. Assuming you have one IDE hard drive and one IDE optical drive, you have room to add two additional IDE devices.
If your motherboard supports cable select and your IDE ribbon cables are 80-conductor, all devices can have their jumper pins set to "CS" (Cable Select) and life is easy, as their Primary (Master) and Secondary (Slave) status is determined by their position on the cable. Otherwise, if your IDE ribbon cables are 40-conductor or your motherboard does not support Cable Select, things get a bit more complicated. As a general rule, the hard drive that your XP resides on (your boot drive) must be set as Master by its jumper pin. No other device can be set as master on the same cable. If all of this sounds like Greek or is too confusing, have the work done at a local reputable PC repair shop.
If you're planning on upgrading your primary hard drive, the complexity factor just went up another big notch, as you must clone your current drive to the new one. You must use a disk imaging or cloning software program to do this... you cannot simply copy things over to the new hard drive. Whatever you do, make sure you have your important data backed up before you do anything. If you take your PC to a local PC repair shop for the upgrades, make sure they understand that you want your current data preserved if you don't have a backup that you made yourself.
Finally, you asked if these upgrades are worth also upgrading the motherboard. The short answer is no, as you may also be required to upgrade your processor, memory type (meaning your current memory cannot be used in addition to the additional memory you're planning on buying), power supply and possibly your video card. Basically, you'd be talking a new PC under the hood. Plus, unless you have a retail version of XP, you will have to purchase and install a new copy of XP, as well as reinstall all your programs and data. Much as you might like to, you cannot simply plug your old hard drive into your new motherboard.
If this is where you're leaning, just bite the bullet and buy or build a new PC and retire the old one.
Whatever you decide, good luck!
James
Doctor Micro, Inc
Finding compatible memory and new hard drive for older PC
by dlee0754 - 10/14/08 12:06 PM In reply to: Finding compatible memory and a new hard drive for an older PC by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
To find the type of RAM you are using, go to URL http://www.cpuid.com/ and download the CPUZ utility. Run it and look under the Memory and SPD tabs. These will give you the type, speed and chip maker of the memory installed now. CPUZ will also tell you the motherboard maker and model, chipset used, and BIOS installed as well as complete info on the CPU you have installed.
Older motherboards generally only support EIDE (Enhanced Integrated Drive Electronics) drives, also commonly referred to as ATA (Advanced Technology Attachment) or PATA (Parallel Advanced Technology Attachment) drives. The interface speeds still available in retail come in ATA-100 (100 megabits/second) and ATA-133 (133 megabits/second). EIDE drives mostly only come at 7,200 RPM spindle speeds, get the largest cache that is available in the price range you are looking at. Also, be aware that older BIOS's may not recognize drive sizes greater than 128 gigabytes. You can check to see if the motherboard maker has a BIOS update that will work with larger drives. WindowsXP without any service packs will also not recognize drive sizes above 128 gigabytes. After you install SP2 or SP3, the entire drive will be recognized, but only if the BIOS recognizes the entire drive.
UDMA (Ultra Direct Memory Access) means that data is passed directly between the hard drive controller and RAM without involving the CPU. This just means that the CPU is not burdened with data traffic between components.
SATA (Serial Advanced Technology Attachment)is the latest interface. It is replacing PATA because it is much faster. It is not compatible with PATA because the connector is very different. SATA currently has two standards, SATA1 and SATA2 (or SATA II). SATA1 has a max throughput of 150 megabits/second and does not support NCQ (Native Command Queuing). SATA II has a max throughput of 300 megabits/seconds and later versions support NCQ. NCQ means that there is no bridging between PATA and SATA commands (some older chipsets converted SATA commands to EIDE commands for the motherboard and vice versa), and commands can be queued up on the bus for faster execution (EIDE can only have one command on the bus at a time). SATA drives can have spindle speeds of 7,200 RPM and 10,000 RPM. Your motherboard most likely does not have any SATA connectors and if it does, they are SATA1.
As a footnote, for the money you may be looking at spending on upgrading your current system, check online sites like TigerDirect, NewEgg, Fry's, etc. for CPU/Motherboard combos. You may be able to upgrade to a faster, more capable system for little more than what you may have to spend on your current system.
Finding compatable memory
by paul53103 - 10/14/08 2:30 PM In reply to: Finding compatible memory and a new hard drive for an older PC by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
Go to any memory manufacturer (example Kingston) and you can eather enter your system specs or on some allow the website to scan your system and they will then list the compatable memory. You can use the memory specs to scan the internet for prices.
Quick answers to easy questions
by caskater4 - 10/17/08 10:46 PM In reply to: Finding compatible memory and a new hard drive for an older PC by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
This post may be a little late for you but...
To very quickly answer your first question, download CPU-Z. It's a great freeware application that will tell you everything you ever needed to know about your PC and has a very simple interface. You can download it at http://www.cpuid.com/cpuz.php
For your second question, there are 3 types of hard drives available today. IDE, the one you're most comfortable with, SATA, which is a replacement for IDE, and SCSI. If you're looking for pure performance SCSI will always be your first choice. No IDE drive ever made can out perform a SCSI drive. However since SCSI are pretty expensive you'll likely not want to spend your money on one. The next fastest drive is SATA. SATA drives are roughly twice as fast as the IDE counterpart and the great part about them is that they are widely available and very cheap. So your decision will come down to this... does your motherboard support IDE only? If so you may just want to stick with an IDE drive. If you really are looking for a performance boost then you'll want to pick up a SATA controller card and buy a SATA drive.
As for your question about SATA II and SATA 2.0... they are basically the same. When choosing a drive just make sure it is capable of 3Gb/s transfer rate. If you were to buy a drive right now i'd recommend the Western Digital WD6400AAKS. They are the fastest suckers available at the moment and are really cheap (they can be found for $75).
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