Community Newsletter: Q&A: Finding compatible memory and a new hard drive for an older PC
- 10/17/08 4:33 PM
Your answer in one simple download
by Forked_Tongue - 10/10/08 11:34 PM In reply to: Finding compatible memory and a new hard drive for an older PC by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
You can download this from Cnet's download section, the program you want to download is PC Wizard 2008, which you can find here http://www.download.com/PC-Wizard-2008/3000-2094_4-10793737.html?tag=mncol&cdlPid=10868055 simply install it and when it first runs it tells you immediately what is your mainboard/motherboard (model number so you can do a search) what chipset it has, your cpu speed, how much ram you have and what type,and your video card type as well, etc. Now that your armed with this information you have to decide is it worth sinking money into an old computer or buying a newer motherboard, cpu, and ram? You can reuse the current hard drive you have though before shutting off the computer uninstall the graphic's driver to avoid a reboot conflict (Xp is tough, after you change out the motherboard, enter the bios, set boot order to CD/Hard drive or whatever, and then have the driver's disk available for the new motherboard and after about 3 reboots you're up and running). Once you identify your board post here and we'll all suggest what memory you should buy or even if you should.
Right now I'm typing on an Intel Atom z530 dual core @ 1600MHz with 2gb of ram which can be put into any tower with a micro-atx form factor (this board has four screws, quick and easy install) which pretty much is any budget tower most people would have bought. I bought the motherboard/cpu combo for $90 and the 2 gb single stick of ram for $25,and reusing the hard drive, Dvd burner, powersupply, and case (I intend to add more hard drives and make this a media file server and will downgrade the powersupply accordingly since it's overkill). If you look around you can do better if you want to do more work (seat a cpu and heatsink/fan combo) and get a better rig (Intel e1200/e1400/e2180 and a cheap board or Amd 4400+ Brisbane/BE-2400 Brisbane 2.3GHz, both brands can be had with a budget board for under a $100 if you shop around, you should be able to reuse everything but ram and possibly video card) for a main duty computer. I wouldn't recommend any single cores though, multicores are the future. Lucky for you most of the budget boards will also have floppy drive (worthless), one ide connector (for CD rom and hard drive), and usually a pair of sata connectors. Another thing you like is that the newer boards support usb booting, with pendrives you can experiment with various versions of linux as well.
UDMA, Ultra DMA, or Ultra Direct Memory Access, it supports direct memory access with ide controller to enable faster data transfers, "Ultra" is a marketting slang for IDE 100/133 speeds.
Sata, Serial ata, a faster interface for data transfers for hard drives, I like the fact it allows better airflow though most cables are way too long. Sata drives and now faster, larger, and cheaper than their IDE counterparts at given comparison points, you'll get more bang for the buck. This is not backwards compatible with most of the older single core models (early p4s and athlons) motherboards usually. Sata 2 is marketting hype, I've yet to see a sata drive that can consistantly deliver on the limits of sata 1, in fact lot of the Western Digital Raptors were the benchmarks and they're sata 1s.
NCQ native command queuing, from wikpedia "Native Command Queuing (NCQ) is a technology designed to increase performance of SATA hard disks under certain situations by allowing the individual hard disk to internally optimize the order in which received read and write commands are executed. This can reduce the amount of unnecessary drive head movement, resulting in increased performance (and slightly decreased wear of the drive) for workloads where multiple simultaneous read/write requests are outstanding, most often occurring in server-type applications. However, the current (as of 2004) technology actually slows down HD access in certain applications, like games and sequential reads & writes, because of the added latency induced by NCQ logic" so it's application dependent.
Dan if you don't mind, give us your intended main intention(s) with this computer, an approx budget, and we'll all pull our hair and argue about the best way to help you spend your money. If you can follow instructions, somewhat capable, and have decent motor skills (main finesse skill is plugging in the front panel wires into the motherboard) you'll do fine if you're open to the option of upgrading.
Awesome download tool!
by 1centwiz - 10/11/08 8:08 PM In reply to: Your answer in one simple download by Forked_TongueThanks for the link. I'll be using it in the future!
Let's all agree not to argue would be my suggestion. lol....
Adding or Replacing Dram Memory on Older PCs
by galvang - 10/10/08 11:53 PM In reply to: Finding compatible memory and a new hard drive for an older PC by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
This can be a tough one, however the memory can be upgraded if the Dram memory is still available. Generally speaking, since the PC is an older type, the older PC operating system (BIOS) can only operate a certain type, size, and speed of DRAM memories. To determine what type of DRAM, first determine the make and model of the PC and contact directly to the Mfg and determine the type of DRAM that can be used for that particular PC. If that information is not available or the MFG no longer exists then do the following:
1. Access the DRAM memory module. Usually it will be a small PCB (SIMM or DIMM) with ICs. usually attached to a connector.
2. Determine the make and model of the DRAM memory PCB. There should be a part number on the PCB or some sort label on the memory module which contains the model #.
3. Contact the DRAM memory module MFG and give them the Module part # and ask if there are any similar ones available.
$. If the Module part number is not available then it becomes a much tougher for the layman and the individual would have to dig down to the IC level to determine what type of memory is being utilized.. Using magnifying glass determine the make and part number of the DRAM IC itself. Usually it will be labeled NEC, Toshiba, Micron, Samsung with a part number.
6. Contact the manufacturer or go to their website and complete a search on the part # for the DRAM. The information will determine what type of memory is being utilized.
7. Once you determine what type memory IC is on the memory module, count the number of DRAM ICs are on the board this will tell the DRAM size of the memory module.
Once you determine the size, speed, type of DRAM memories then you can contact the DRAM IC manufacturer or a memory board house and determine if the memory modules are still available. Memory board houses such as Kingston Technologies or Smart Modular are good sources of information. The Memory board houses that I just mentioned may have information on what can be used for your older PCs when it comes to DRAM Memory modules. This would be an alternate method. Good luck.
dan c. finding new memory and hard drive for an older pc
by 00dragonfly00 - 10/11/08 12:04 AM In reply to: Finding compatible memory and a new hard drive for an older PC by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
hi, for an older pc: pentium 2/3 sdram 168 pins, maximum speed 133mhz, front side bus 66/133mhz, i suggest an external hd, if you have a usb port, to inside, take the same brand name and same speed, than older, there are some limit about the capacity, 20/40gb, but none if you used external, make sure you have the xp dics, with the id number from microsoft, for the sata is retrocompatible with all sata port but older pc don't have sata, for ide hd look your cable, you have 2 connectors with 40 pins, look for the red line on the cable is the number one pin, put the same dics on ide 1, and dvd or cd on ide 2, don't forget to select master or slave for both of them. good luck.
try crucial.com
by mrobinsonjr - 10/11/08 12:24 AM In reply to: Finding compatible memory and a new hard drive for an older PC by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
go to crucial.comand click on the "Scan My System" button. if you use internet explorer you will be asked to install a activex control , to do this click on the yellow bar near the top of your browser and ckicl instal activex control. after that click run. following that there will be a webpage containing your memory specs.
now if you rin Mozilla firefox or any other web browser. it will say you need to download the 112kb file do that, after it has downloaded, run it, a black cmd box should appear and go away. following that it will open your web browser to a page that contains the memory specs.
and as far a hdd goes if you take out the old one and put a new one in you will need to reinstall windows. to advoid that i reccommend that you install and configure your jumpers to master-slave configuration. if you system has ide/ata you will need to search google.com for your hdd. DO NOT BUY THE SATA DRIVE!! it will NOT work with ide. the interfaces are completely differant and there is no ide to sata adapter. now if your system does support the sata drive then you can buy one.
about seek times i cannot answer that because i do not know if this is a desktop computer or a laptop computer.
Good luck
Compatible memory
by valpap - 10/11/08 12:35 AM In reply to: Finding compatible memory and a new hard drive for an older PC by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
Hi.
It is not very long that I extended the memory of my pc.
Even for me who I don't know many things about hardware, it was very easy.
Taking the advise of a good friend, I opened the tower,took off the ram and in the shop where I went they gave me a compatible one .
then I put THEM both into the tower.
My desktop is also running Windows XP.
I have to admit that I felt very proud of my achievement!!
I would seriously consider whether it is WORTH upgrading
by kLevkoff - 10/11/08 1:13 AM In reply to: Finding compatible memory and a new hard drive for an older PC by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
You can probably still get an IDE hard drive for $50 or so if you look around - which is what most older XP-vintage machines use. Most new machines use SATA, which is NOT compatible with IDE. You can add a SATA interface card to an older machine - but that adds to the cost of the drive. (I have never seen a single drive that will work with either IDE or SATA.)
There are several different types of RAM - and the differences include architecture and speed. You would need to find out what type your old machine requires from the specs. Older machines often have limits on the amount of memory they can hold as well, so you might not even be able to add more of the correct type. (Or you might have to discard and replace some of what you already have if all of the RAM slots are full.) Some of the memory used by older machines has actually gotten more expensive, or very difficult to find, although you can probably get that on eBay for next to nothing.
You should, however, VERY SERIOUSLY consider scrapping the old machine and replacing it with a new one. New PCs are very inexpensive at the moment (a reasonable Dell from Best Buy can be had for about $400). You could well spend $100 or $200, and a lot of time, to upgrade your old one and still end up with a machine nowhere near as fast or reliable as a new one - and upgrading everything to the latest and greatest will cost a LOT more than simply buying a new machine. If you are even CONSIDERING going as far as to replace the motherboard, then replace the whole machine (all you would be keeping would be some outdated drives and a $25 case and power supply).
When deciding, consider that a new machine will probably have more memory, a faster and much larger hard drive, a faster processor, a faster motherboard architecture (front-side bus and such), a fast DVD burner, USB 2 ports (many older machines have the MUCH slower USB 1 ports), and a better graphics card. It will also have Vista (whether you consider that a plus or a minus).
If anything, consider keeping that old clunker as a "second machine", since it probably works just fine for office work - but save your "upgrade budget" for a nice new machine.
Pc is not brand name no problem
by raihan_786 - 10/11/08 1:14 AM In reply to: Finding compatible memory and a new hard drive for an older PC by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
Pc is not brand name no problem but did you know how much your pc speed? if you don’t know click start, choose run option or (winkey +R) write dialog box dxdiag then enter. You can find all information on your pc, such as system manufacturer, system model, bios, processor, memory ext...
If you pc is speed is 500MHz to 1490 Mhz (processor) Generally use SDRam, 1500mhz to 2000Mhz use SDram ,DD1 ram broth , 2000 mhz to 3600 mhz (Including duel core system mother board) use DD1 ,DD2 Ram, So, choose you ram which kind of use you system.
Do you think more ram more speed? Absolutely not, make clean weekly on your pc such as disk defragment, off system restore, Temp file ext…
On you HDD, if your mother board is supported PATA (ID) only you can do nothing but some external device PATA (ID) to SATA convertor is available in market. Enjoy
if you need contact me below is email address
raihan_rr@yahoo.com or raihan_786@hotmail.com
Finding compatible memory and a new hard drive for an older
by bob wearn - 10/11/08 1:26 AM In reply to: Finding compatible memory and a new hard drive for an older PC by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
Crucial.com is definitely the way to go for memory.
Old IDE drives are sometimes called PATA (at least here in the UK).
Finding the right compatible memory upgrade to an older PC
by blitz102 - 10/11/08 3:29 AM In reply to: Finding compatible memory and a new hard drive for an older PC by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
I learned this also to my instructor in Advance PC Assembly and I want this to share to you what Ive learned.All you have to do is go to website http://www.crucial.com using your old PC and browse the site.Then scan your system or computer and afterwards they will show what kind of memory you have in your PC , how many memory slots you have what size, speed and what upgrade you need to your older PC.Also included are the manufacturer or your motherboard and what model is your motherboard.And also you can check where you can buy the memory you needed and the price itself.I guess this will solve your problem in finding the right memory of your older PC.
Finding compatible memory and a new hard drive for an older
by paddy paws - 10/11/08 4:01 AM In reply to: Finding compatible memory and a new hard drive for an older PC by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
From what I have read, I agree with going to www.crucial.com and using their memory scanner. I've got some of their basic value ram, it worked first go and its still working. For a hard drive, look at your motherboard, find the name, model and revision number, google that info or go to the makers site eg www.gigabyte.com.tw or www.ecs.com.tw, search and you can find the board manual. I reccomend getting a seagate or western digital hard drive. their websites have drive setup software AND drive diagnostic software. If you buy a 2nd user drive, use this first to check the drive and zero wipe it, (low level format)then partition, install your op system or just format it for data storage. Hope you can follow my garbage. Ian
Upgrading Your Computer
by waytron - 10/11/08 6:08 AM In reply to: Finding compatible memory and a new hard drive for an older PC by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
Upgrading the RAM on your computer is probably the single easiest and best return on investment you can make when it comes to increasing the performance of your machine. Most people find that the perceived performance increase diminishes the higher you go. Thus you are likely to realize a big improvement going from 256meg to 512meg but not as noticeable when upgrading from lets say 1gig to 2gig and even less when going from 2 gig to 3. Also, with the extremely low price on memory theses days, I would recommend you just go ahead and replace all the memory rather than trying to add to what is already there. You will be much more likely to run into problems and incompatibilities when mixing different brands of memory. There are many different types of memory and it is extremely important that you install the correct type and size. There are at least 3 ways to discover the type of memory your computer requires:
1. Go to www.crucial.com and simply click on “Scan My System” to let their automatic Scanner tool analyze your computer. It will tell you what you currently have installed, how much your computer can hold and recommend what to purchase. Their prices are very reasonable and if you purchase the memory from them, they will guarantee that it works.
2. Remove the computer cover and look at the System Motherboard for the manufacturers name and model number and then go to their website and download the specifications for that motherboard.
3. Remove the cover to your computer and remove one of the current memory modules and in most cases it will have a sticker indicating the type and size of the memory module. But, this will not tell you anything about the system or what the maximum amount of RAM your computer can hold, so you are better off using the Crucial Scanner or finding the model number of the motherboard.
HARD DRIVES
There are several reasons for replacing your hard but performance is probably the least attractive reason unless you are planning to fork out the bucks for a couple of striped Western Digital Velociraptor Drives. If you are running out of Drive space or your current drive is over 4 years old, then you should go ahead and replace it, but unless your current drive is actually failing, you probably will not see much of a performance difference. There are many types of hard drives available but if your computer is a slightly older Windows XP machine then it pretty much boils down to probably either PATA (Parallel ATA) or SATA (Serial ATA). You can typically tell the difference because PATA drives will have a 2” wide ribbon cable to connect to the motherboard and SATA uses a smaller 3/8” wide cable. If you are still not sure or want to learn more about what you currently have, simply look up the make and model number of your Hard Drive on the internet. Again, discovering the actual make and model of your motherboard will go a long way toward finding out what type of drives your system can support. Plus you may need the motherboard information later to be able to download any drivers that you may need. As long as you are upgrading things, you just might want to update the motherboard’s bios, and drivers too. If you are actually starting to think about upgrading the hard drive interface to something faster such as SATAII, then you are probably better off at this point, purchasing a new computer. There comes a point that it is usually cheaper or better to buy a whole new computer rather than upgrading all the individual components. Adding some additional memory and maybe a new hard drive is one thing, but beyond that you might as well just start over, unless you are just doing it for the experience or for the fun of it. If you try to upgrade the motherboard, you will almost always have to purchase new memory and a new processor and maybe even a new power supply and video card. Note: If you are avoiding purchasing a new computer simply because you don’t want Windows Vista, you can still purchase computers with Windows XP installed from many vendors who sell to businesses such as Dell. Just click on computers for business instead of for Home.
Happy Computing!
Dana
Wayland Computer
A few mistakes...
by BigGuns149 - 10/19/08 12:41 AM In reply to: Upgrading Your Computer by waytronFor starters, the scanning tool off of crucial's website while it ideally should know how much memory is in the machine often report no memory at all. I have found it fails so often as to be a waste of time. You are better off downloading CPU-Z or a one of the many similar tools off of the internet.
Next, I beg to differ that a new drive won't improve performance. Especially if the hard drive is nearly full even a typical 7200rpm hard drive will slighly improve performance. Before about 2004 most hard drives were 5400RPM drives. Between moving to a faster spinning drive and more cache a lot of users with their older hard drives ironically will see some improvement in performance. While the access times won't be much better, it isn't out of the realm of impossibility that the new HDD might be able to read twice as much data per second as the old drive.
Finally, if you want to keep on using Windows XP, I wouldn't necessarily say that building your own machine is such a bad idea. The choices for prefab computers with Windows XP are needlessly said underwhelming and because the options are becoming limited you aren't going to find a lot of great deals. While people mention Dell a lot, their prices on XP boxes are pretty unimpressive. Unless you have a coupon code for Dell you can ironically build a better system for the same price the Dell charges except for instead of having a components that are warrantied for a year a lot of the components will be warrantied for 3 years or more.
Sandra for the memory; IDE for the drive.
by DavidHimself - 10/11/08 8:15 AM In reply to: Finding compatible memory and a new hard drive for an older PC by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
What memory you need depends entirely on the motherboard. System Information (in Accessories->System tools) might tell you, but probably won't. Download SIS Sandra. It's free and you can get it right here at CNET (download.com).
Once you know what make and model of motherboard you have, Google it. You'll find the specs somewhere.
Older vs. newer memory is not so much about speed--it's whether it will fit in the slot (number of pins). You should expect that older memory will be more expensive than the new stuff, since they aren't cranking it out anymore.
If you need older RAM, you'll probably need an IDE drive. Again, it ain't the speed; it's whether it will fit. If you have an older motherboard that supports SATA, that's fine, but the SATA connector will NOT come with a SATA drive. So unless you held on to the ones that came with the motherboard, you'll have to hunt. They're not expensive; just next to impossible to find.
When you say it's not a new machine, that means different things to different people. My mother still refers to the IMac she got six years ago as "the new computer." If it's more than three years old, you might want to consider that you got your money's worth from that machine before you spend a couple hundred bucks and at least a couple of days frustration to wind up with an faster and bigger obsolete computer. (You could always put Linux on the old machine. It's free and will provide you with the opportunity for infinitely more frustration.)
pc info
by Garken - 10/11/08 8:30 AM In reply to: Finding compatible memory and a new hard drive for an older PC by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
download SiSoft Sandra Lite ( free ). It will give you all the info on ur puter that you need to buy the correct parts.
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