Storage: Hard drive not storage, then what is?
Hard drive not storage, then what is?
by The ancient one - 9/11/08 6:22 PMI have been following various threads in this forum and have more or less come to the conclusion that there is no such thing as good, safe storage, particularly for a large amount of it. Here are few kinds that come to mind:
The floppy, the zip drive, CD’s, DVD’s, tape, hard drives, flash drives, and online storage; and the problems that I see with each
Floppy – Very limited space and subject to mildew
Zip Drive – More space but still subject to mildew
CD – Considerably more space and not subject to mildew and less easily damaged, but not rewriteable, therefore necessitating burning a new CD each time data is changed.
CDRW- See above. Data can be changed but they are less reliable than a CDR.
DVD’s – See CD above but even with much more space, but more easily damaged, particularly if one uses a jewel case designed for CD’s. This causes flexing which can easily render a DVD (computer burned) useless.
Tape – I have had no experience, but since this is magnetic tape it is easily subject to mildew
Hard Drives – Ample space, data can be changed easily, but hard drives can fail, thereby losing all data.
Flash Drives – Space nearly equal to a DVD and can easily be changed. Less subject to failure Take up little space (but can easily be misplaced because of that)
All of the above devices could easily be lost through theft or destroyed in a flood or fire unless kept off premise, and even that is no guarantee.
Online Storage – Not subject to loss by theft or destruction in a home or office fire. Data can be changed. On the other hand, one must have access to the internet, with high speed updoading capability and an ISP that will allow much broadband usage. One website that I investigated looked good, with an unlimited amount of storage space, but one could only upload 2GB of data each day. At that rate it was going to take me nearly to 2 months to upload everything.
I have over 100GB of data comprised of over 2 million files. That is why I have opted for the use of an external hard drive which certainly has its pitfalls. It is used only once a month to update it with those files and folders that have changed, and then is kept in a bank safety deposit box.. Besides this hard drive I have another external hard drive with essentially the same data that is kept on premise and an internal slave drive again with essentially the same data.
I know that at least one of the moderators does not consider hard drives to be storage, but unless someone can give me a better idea than what I am doing now, I guess I will continue with it.
Well discussed.
by R. Proffitt
- 9/11/08 6:56 PM
In reply to: Hard drive not storage, then what is? by The ancient one
This is very old IT lore. Feel free to use hard disks as storage but where is the write protection? Look at how many keep just one copy on that external and lose it all.
As to CD, DVD the issue you brought up of damage and mildew would apply to hard disks too.
Ouch, time to pull up the archives here. Here's the quick rundown.
1. More than one copy.
2. Copies keep off site in locations away from the originals.
3. Write protection of some sort. (Why is simply because a virus could delete that hard disk in one second.)
There's more but we only need to watch and read this forum to learn that USB hard disks are failing as backup.
Bob
Thanks for the info
by The ancient one - 9/13/08 4:06 PM In reply to: Well discussed. by R. Proffitt
I mentioned the mildew because while living in Hawaii, I lost all of my floppies, Zip discs, and also all of my VHS tapes do to mildew, plus, of course, damaged the floppy drive and zip drive with mildewed discs. I did not have any problem with CD's in regard to mildew and that may be do to their being in jewel cases.
I know that I could loose my data because of a virus. At this point all that I have been doing is to scan the folders that I am backing up with my anti-virus software before doing the back up.
Storage back-up
by Willy - 9/11/08 7:06 PM In reply to: Hard drive not storage, then what is? by The ancient oneHD, had very limited space when 1st introduced yrs. back. the beauty of a HD is access to/from was quick compared to other media, plus you erase and re-use on demand quite easily. All the other media you mentioned do have their pitfalls, but most has either been eclipsed or lost popularity for whatever reason. The best storage is 9-trk tape(any tape in gen.), which is limited support on PCs and never was in any big way. The data on it can last for yrs. and is easily stored, provided you have the room. Other tape is 1/4in. carts and others. The HD is simple choice now because it can handle so much. But, at the same time having all that data on a singular source is a lost if a glitch comes along. This leaves us with CDs(any type), provided you have access to "gold surface media" which is the best unlike the typical offering now.
Since you want to save data on HD. You're best bet is using at least 3 HDs all having the same copy. THis applies to any media you plan to use, in fact it is common in the business to have 4 copies. One in use, on-site in storage, immediate spare and the last off-site storage. If you like rent space in a nuclear bunker converted for data storage.
tada -----Willy 
Mildew?
by msgale - 9/26/08 6:29 PM In reply to: Storage back-up by WillyI have used tape for backup and as a storage medium since 1967, never saw mildew, never had a problem. The biggest problem with tape is cost. Tape drives are expensive, and high density tape is also costly. Most large data centers backup to tape. The operational program used on the P3C ASW Aircraft, was on tape, and the mission data came back on tape.
Tape
by Willy - 9/29/08 9:57 AM In reply to: Mildew? by msgaleTape has been used for yrs. as you've noted. Many a business has some storage facility or service that provides this for tapes, which is why I mentioned it(storage). However, it does get into a pickle when you have 5-10-20+yrs. of data sitting, there but it is important to some companies/govt., like oil&gas, NASA, IRS, roads and etc.. You get the idea, but the cost for only a few hi-den tapes wouldn't be too much of burden if safe data back-up is the prime concern. As for any offsite service using the www for back-up you pay deary for such use and if you have globs of data its costly. Further, some have gone out of business and users had to scramble to save data.
tada -----Willy
Online Storage
by Dango517 - 9/26/08 8:39 PM In reply to: Hard drive not storage, then what is? by The ancient onemight be your best answer. There are professional services that do this as well. Fees vary.
These days, by-the-way, PCs come equipped with over 300GBs of hard drive space and 1TB are becoming somewhat common. 100GB isn't all that much, small actually. I realize you said, "compressed".
Your system sounds pretty complete but it all depends on the data. I get a feeling that data is valuable.
A Professional consultant might be advised.
Dango517 is posting a reply to: Hard drive not storage, then what is?
by The ancient one - 9/11/08 6:22 PM
"I have over 100GB of data comprised of over 2 million files. That is why I have opted for the use of an external hard drive which certainly has its pitfalls. It is used only once a month to update it with those files and folders that have changed, and then is kept in a bank safety deposit box.. Besides this hard drive I have another external hard drive with essentially the same data that is kept on premise and an internal slave drive again with essentially the same data."
This thread untracked.
Two hard disks
by 3rdalbum - 9/27/08 3:06 AM In reply to: Hard drive not storage, then what is? by The ancient oneYou should use two hard disks, for redundancy, and have them both in different places.
Hard disks are very cheap per gigabyte and are sealed, which makes them quite resiliant and cost-effective for backups. I've got a hard disk a metre away from me that's survived ten years with infrequent use with no "mildew".
There simply isn't another answer. Both tape and Blu-ray are high capacity, but the drives and media are expensive and hard to come by. Hard disk capacities keep going up and prices keep going down.
If you're worried about viruses, you could try doing your backups from a Linux live CD. If you boot up from the CD and plug your external hard disk in, it and your internal hard drive will appear on the desktop and you can drag and drop files without fear of active viruses.
There is also a Linux command that, among other things, makes an exact bit-for-bit copy of a hard disk and puts it into a file. This file can then be mounted as though it were a real hard disk, or directly written to a real hard disk so you can boot Windows from it. It involves going to the terminal, but if you knew how powerful this command was, you'd understand why there is not a GUI for it. It can also delete data if used without proper care, so either be extra careful or seek help from a Linux user!
Use DVD
by mwooge - 9/27/08 8:57 AM In reply to: Hard drive not storage, then what is? by The ancient oneBack up to DVD and store off-site. Don't worry about bending the disk. Be sure to verify the data on the disk before ending the BU session. Don't throw away your old backups, keep at least one old BU as a back-up backup.
I'd also reccomend getting a safe, for your backups and other must-be-kept-safe items. Be sure to bolt it to the floor, and do not keep a written copy of the combination anywhere near the safe.
One word
by tek-ed - 9/28/08 7:14 PM In reply to: Hard drive not storage, then what is? by The ancient oneRAID.
Today's RAID technology is so cheap, there is no reason to NOT use it! In fact, you can purchase external RAID devices.
I purchased a RAID card that does RAID 1, 0 and 10. That card cost me $8 at Geeks.com. I then purchased 4 250GB drives and did a RAID 10 and can get 500GB of automatically duplicated storage. Never have to worry about loosing another file! All photos and MP3s are stored on my RAID drives. Currently I have over a terabyte of RAID storage. Plus, I also use MOZY to backup some files over the net. Unfortunatly, their free service only offers 2gb...and that's not nearly enough for my needs...basically only my most important files are backed up.
Ed
Hard drivenot storage, then what is?
by hueassa - 9/30/08 5:20 AM In reply to: Hard drive not storage, then what is? by The ancient oneEven on-line storage sites are not reliable, Once upon a time I had an account at a storage site that was called Mediamax, After few months they announced that they chaned their name to UpLink and they are transferring my documents to the new site. Now, I tried to log in to my account at that site, I received a message that says: Sorry, Mediamax and UpLink are now closed.
I lost my files forever.
Online storage...yes 'it sounds great' but your story...
by VAPCMD - 9/30/08 9:43 AM In reply to: Hard drivenot storage, then what is? by hueassaabout the business closing or them lsoing it plus the risk of personal data being stolen...don't think I'll be trying that anytime soon.
VAPCMD
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