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Car Tech: Remembering the EV-1
Remembering the EV-1
by phoenixzion - 9/16/08 12:45 PMSo, as I'm browsing I notice that GM is announcing its "new" electric car concept, the Volt.
Cute, but what about the EV-1 that GM sunk at the end of the 20th century? The EV-1 was a fully electric car the GM FAILED to back, promote. The promises of H2 were coming around (at a time when they had already said, "just 5 more years".
I want urge everyone to go and watch the documentary,
"Who Killed the Electric Car?"
Spoiler Alret: Exxon and GM killed it because of obvious reasons.
I just want to help people remember that it was this company that said just 7 years ago, "Theres no demand for electric cars" and then went and built bigger and more gas guzzling vehicles.
Magically....they are releasing "concepts?".
I want to call BULL ****!!!
The technology has been there for a long time, its just they didn't want us to have it and they did their best to cover it up by destroying every last EV-1 they had.
Go ahead....google EV-1
And Massachusetts bans the electric car.
by R. Proffitt
- 9/16/08 6:15 PM
In reply to: Remembering the EV-1 by phoenixzion
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&safe=off&q=massachusetts+bans+electric+car&btnG=Search
It's the only one you could buy today and they pull the plug.
Bob
EV1 vs Volt
by WaltT - 9/18/08 4:25 AM In reply to: Remembering the EV-1 by phoenixzionHi,
Yup I remember the EV1 saw one when I was a kid back in the day. A guy from the states was visiting here in Canada. It was a really nice car and it made sense, all electric no gas. I wondered what happened to them then saw the documentary. Funny thing the Volts frame design with the battery placement is pretty much the EV1, with the exception of the added gas engine. In my opinion they should have just brought back the EV1, but that owuld mean they would have to admit the truth about how they were and still are in cohoots with gas industry and don't really care about the enviroment or what the consumer wants.
As the documentary points out the battery tech does exist, a gas engine is not neccesary for the Volt.
Ask the question.
by R. Proffitt - 9/18/08 4:30 AM
In reply to: EV1 vs Volt by WaltT
"How many more trillion dollars of business is there to be done with gas, diesal (gas or liquid fuel) is there to be done?"
re: EV1 vs Volt
by wcunning
- 9/18/08 10:01 AM
In reply to: EV1 vs Volt by WaltT
A lot of the research that GM did for the EV1 is going into the Volt, such as low rolling resistance tires and regen braking. The reason they put the gas engine in there is to get range beyond 40 miles. A car that can only go 40 miles (a range that varies drastically depending on how you drive) only works for a niche market. GM wants to market a car that will be at least as popular as the Prius, so it has to have range equivalent to the gas-engined competition.
Crockumentary
by borgward1 - 9/18/08 5:15 PM In reply to: Remembering the EV-1 by phoenixzionUnfortunately, this film, "Who Killed the Electric Car" is referred to by the engineers who worked on the EV-1 as a "crockumentary." There was no conspiracy to kill the car, and the technology used for the 1st generation was not exactly an environmental triumph, unless you like lead plates and battery acid.
"GM never offered the EV1 for public sale. It was only available to consumers under a lease program that had a "no purchase" clause disallowing the vehicle's re-purchase at the conclusion of the lease. 660 Generation One EV1s were produced for the 1997 model year,[2] using lead acid batteries;[3]and each found a lessee.
In December 1999, GM released approximately 200 of the new Generation Two 1999 EV1s with the new nickel metal hydride battery. Over the next 8 months, the remaining 257 Generation Two EV1s were released to certain selected lessees which initiated a lengthy waiting list.[4] In mid 2000, GM closed the EV1 plant. A total of 457 Generation Two EV1s were produced and all were eventually leased.
On March 2, 2000, 450 Generation One EV1s were recalled by GM due to a faulty charge port cable that GM determined would lead to heat buildup and even fire. Despite the initial claim of only sixteen "thermal incidents" and no property damage, at least one fire originating at the charge port actually occurred, destroying the car of Ron Brauer and Ruth Bygness as it charged[5]. This did not affect the Generation Two EV1s.[6]
Over the next two years, approximately 200 of the Generation One EV1s were re-issued to their original lessees on revised two-year leases including a new limited-mileage clause.[7] The delays were due to design complications in retrofitting the NiMH battery.[8] Due to the tenuous retrofitting process and limited number of recall replacement parts available, GM offered the waiting Generation One lessees the opportunity to terminate their lease at no charge,[9][10] or the chance to transfer the lease to one of the few 150 Generation Two EV1s left — ahead of those already on the Generation Two waiting list.[11]"
Remembering the EV-1
by STROKER 526 - 9/27/08 2:02 AM In reply to: Remembering the EV-1 by phoenixzionYes, you are correct the EV-1 was the right car comming out at the right time back in the mid 1990's for us the consumers of the World. But the wicked intent of the Automakers & Gas Companies is clearly shown in the current Economic Situation all Nations find themselves in Right this moment, triggered by the unrelenting greed of the Gas Companies to strip us all of every possible dime! The same way they Killed the EV-1 they are sabbotaging the Chevy Volt and all other Concept Electric Cars by putting in inferior Batteries with Less than a 50 mile range when 150 mile range units were created in the early 2000's. and putting YES a small gasoline motor to charge thr 40 Mi. units. If that's not bad enough they want to lease the bad batteries to the car buying public for $10,000.00 per car!!! This has now become a National Sercurity for each Country. And Someone has to put their foot down and say "ENOUGH IS ENOUGH".
GM's business model has been planned obsolescense
by MarcBayside - 11/26/08 8:32 PM In reply to: Remembering the EV-1 by phoenixzionresponding to Borg...
While you seem to be attempting to downplay the message of the movie"Who Killed the Electric Car" and explain that the first generation of lead acid batteries were replaced in the 2nd generation, what you don't explain 1) is that GM already owned an interest in Ovionics which did the R&D and manufactured NiMH batteries in the late 90's and 2) besides the fact that the people leasing the 2nd wave of EV's that had the NiMH installed from the get go were not allowed to either renew the lease at the end of the term or to purchase the vehicles. The only explaination for GM destroying these beautiful vehicles was due to not wanting more than minimal public recongintion or interest .
The fact that the EVs could go 150 miles between charges and the volt which doesn't promise to get more than 40 miles per charge is getting far more advertising just further suggests that GM is planning the electric car to be a failure.
Further, the Volt is expected to list for $40,000. That is before a $7,500 credit which Wagoner mananged to hustle from Resident Bush. It was special legislation pork for a car spelled v o l t.
GM's business model has been planned obsolescense
Should GM be bailed out?
by MarcBayside - 11/26/08 8:40 PM In reply to: GM's business model has been planned obsolescense by MarcBaysideWhat is the answer to the auto mobile industry bail out? Does it make any sense to provide financial assistance to companies that have Board of Directors and CEOs that treat the business like an ATM machine? I agreed with Representative Ackerman getting mad at CEOs callousness to fly personal jets into DC to ask for a hand out. They fought CAFÉ standards for 35 years and GM cajoled Bush to use the Federal Government to help GM fight California Zero Emission Vehicle mandate-ZEV. Why did Japanese companies manage to build a reputation for efficient dependable sturdy small cars at a time while Detroit whined that standards would ruin them? Now they want our help after telling us to take a leap. The reason to bail out these businesses has less than nothing to do with the Management, Board of Directors and CEOs who we should now dismiss.
The foremost reason to save these companies is because so many citizens rely on jobs that exist either directly as employees of Ford, GM and Chrylser or that they work for companies such as Johnson Control maker of lead acid car batteries commonly used in combustion vehicles for starting and for powering other components of their electrical systems. Johnson Ctrl also makes interior modules. Other suppliers would also be adversely effected by further economic turmoil by the auto makers.
Since one of the advantages that foreign manufacturers such as in Japan and Europe seem to have is that because they have national health care systems for working age people, the employer is not burdened with the cost but which is instead spread across the society’s population.
Before the company gets a dime it should be stipulated that the economic support is pre conditioned. The CEOS and Bd. of Dir won’t like being told that any one kept on will be paid at Federal Civil Service Grade. Next, is that hearings must be held to review subversion of government regulations, officials and state rights. Interview Stanford Ovshinsky and ask him to tell what happened to the car he envisioned. Did GM keep their promises to him?
I’ld love to see Stanford Ovshinsky invited to testify and tell his story of 40 years of inventing and founder of ECD and Ovionics. After all his work developing the NiMH battery, GM told him to keep his mouth shut and not advertise his achievement to the world. Tom Hanks would be another interesting individual to testify as a prior GM EV leaseholder. Of all the people interviewed in the movie “Who Killed the Electric Car”, Hanks appeared to be especially outspoken and informative and seem a compelling proponent. . Another interesting figure could be Senator Nate Holden who also worked 17 years in Aerospace including on the Lunar Module.
“November 18, 2008 -- Former California State Senator and Los Angeles City Councilman Nate Holden held a news conference, speaking out against American auto manufacturers and in support of mass-production of the electric car. The Honorable Nate Holden believes that the taxpayers should not bailout the auto manufacturers without The Big Three agreeing to mass-produce the electric car as an incentive”
“General Motors embarked on a program to deceive the public and the lawmakers. They introduced the EV1 as a revolutionary concept car. The EV1 could have saved the automobile industry from its financial woes. At the beginning, General Motors and the other auto manufacturers never intended for the electric vehicle to be a successful program, specifically the EV1. “
GM has had a dubious history subverting ZEV and café standards. “General Motors has had at least ten years notice to develop and mass-produce an electric vehicle and they have failed to do so. They have continuously brainwashed the public and the elected officials, claiming that they were on our side and they are not! Here they are again, demanding that the hard-working taxpayers bail them out. (Them being the automobile manufacturers) They are demanding the bailout funding without any pre-conditions.”
Interview an official from Chevron Texaco and ask them to describe their motivation for the apparent mothballing of Ovionics. Are they willing to allow the ovionics technology to again be used so that we can have electric cars with a 150 mile range like we did ten years ago rather than the Chevy Volt 40 mile range? Is it possible to take a new interpretation of imminent domain which I believe generally pertains to the government confiscation of private land for the assumed public good. Allow the transferring the spirit of imminent domain to intellectual property which if actually allowed to be used by interested parties would revolutionize the auto industry with charging ranges almost 4x that of the Chevy Volt.
Ask Toyota management how they managed to make the most popular hybrid ? Have a College Engineering professor compare the GM EV and RAV EV of the early ‘90s with the Chevy Volt due in another year or so?
Besides perhaps watching “Who Killed the Electric Car” perhaps also watch “Tucker”, That was a similar story from over 50 years ago.
The American car company management have been shortsighted and relied on sabotaging innovation to sustain obsolescence as their business model. The answer to management is Game over . We will save the companies for the sake of the economy and employees not for overpaid management ..
This is a good place for a plugin
by rustytoo - 8/26/09 11:58 PM In reply to: Should GM be bailed out? by MarcBaysideWell eye for an eye(screw them). I don't drive a lot, anything 60+ range would be great! I dont mind the ICE for a kind of backup but if the car had a 100mi range to start with it wouldn't need it!
Till the big 3 (or anyone)make an affordable plugin car I AINT BUYIN'!!!
I give full kudos to the likes of Tesla Motors for a great car, problem is that with a small company is that they can't sell it that cheap(for the masses). Gimme an equivalent EV1 for 25K and I'm in. It's been said that the all electric car is not for everyone(just 90%) well I agree!
Wanna sell more cars?? Build what we want!!
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