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Community Newsletter: Q&A: External hard-drive buying advice and backing up data

by Lee Koo (ADMIN) Moderator - 8/8/08 10:24 AM
Post 76 of 258

Actually External Are Good, More Redundant when combined wit

by mister8guy - 8/2/08 11:01 AM In reply to: Extenuating circumstances. by hung0702

You can have as many internal hard drives as you want, but something that no one has mentioned thus far is that every single one of them can be killed in an instant and all at the same time. I'm not talking about the "lone lightning bolt" theory, although that can happen too. I'm talking about any number of problems such as a power source that kills itself suddenly and also kills all drives and most devices attached to it (even including the mother board). This happened to me, and I had to replace basically everything on the PC because of it.

However, External USB hard drives are not susceptable to this problem (mine didn't die when everything internal on the computer did). External hard drives if used in a methodical and consistent way can be the solution. Think about it... What are the chances that it will die and fail on you? Well actually pretty good according to the horror stories already logged on these threads. However, what are the chances that both your internal hard drive and your external drives would both die. Those chances are horrible. If your internal drive dies, chances are your external won't because it would be two separate vectors (the vector that killed your internal and the vector that killed your external). That just ain't gonna happen by and large.

The only way internal and external die at once is if some one breaks into your home and steals both simultaneously, or if your house burns down and both are cooked in the flames. Not much you can do to prevent any of that though, and they are really quite remote possibilities in themselves.

Making some CD and DVD backups is a good idea for additional redundancy. But, seriously, do it sparingly cuz the earth is gonna be chock full of useless plastic junk like old back up CD's, which is totally gross in my opinion. Mainly what you should burn discs for is for ghost images of your whole system, so you can restore it in minutes after the failure back to the condition as if nothing happened, and then load in your data from the external hard drive or CD's. Ghost from Norton (if its even still around) is not the best software out there in my opinion. Drive Image used to be the best but that was killed a while back when Norton bought them out. Now Acronis makes a good back up system, and bonus is that it can schedule as many data file backups as you want on a daily, weekly, etc. basis. You can back up your photos every day if you want if you are a photographer and you add photos daily. Then other things that you rarely add to can be backed up less often. This can be superior to one huge data backup that backs everything up.

Nothing's perfect. There's always still a chance however remote that you will get screwed by fate and end up with lost data. Redundancy is best, but no war on memory loss will ever be full proof... just like all those other wars on inanimate objects.... drugs, terror, etc.

Post 77 of 258

don't use a "spare" hard drive

by mikie666 - 8/2/08 11:14 AM In reply to: Actually External Are Good, More Redundant when combined wit by mister8guy

i was lazy, or cheap. i used a spare (read old) hard drive for my external back up. i got what i paid for.LOL -mike

Post 78 of 258

Listen to this man.

by hung0702 - 8/2/08 8:20 PM In reply to: Actually External Are Good, More Redundant when combined wit by mister8guy

He's right, but there's really no need to have ANY extra drives if you don't plan on moving anything under 2 GB around. I guess it just matters on your tech-lifetstyle. I don't forsee me buying/using an external HDD in the near future. I burn to DVDs and use 4 GB flash drives to move larger files (I.E. .iso and such).

Post 79 of 258

Sorry to burst any bubbles

by safraneuser - 8/6/08 1:05 PM In reply to: Actually External Are Good, More Redundant when combined wit by mister8guy

The 50/50 Rule .... When you have a 50/50 chance of getting it right, there is always a 90% probability that it will go wrong. The following is 100% true, I kid you not.
I started my PC one morning, only to find the secondary hard drive with all my photos etc stored on it (cos 'the primary is more likely to fail first')no longer existed .. dead, deceased, finished.
"not to worry", thinks I, its all backed up on my external USB drive. I switched it on and .. 'click, click, click, click' ... Dead!! Thank heavens for the other external USB drive ... 'click, click .. click, click' as dead as the other two. "Oh no!!" But wait, I have a DVD with most of it on .. Ha Ha!! ... Then the famous "Please put a disk in the DVD drive". I will clean the disk and the drive .. "unknown media on the disk ... blah, blah".
Now I see that even SD cards are not fool-proof. Sheesh.
I think I will go with mister8guy's suggestion og backing up daily for photos etc and weekly or monthly for other stuff; photobucket has done me proud for a while but not all my latest stuff was on there .. that's my own fault.

Post 80 of 258

Backing up

by Neil Bradley - 9/5/08 9:54 PM In reply to: Actually External Are Good, More Redundant when combined wit by mister8guy

Mr.8guy is right-couldn't say it any better. I have Acronis & they tell you NOT to use cd/dvds etc.because of 'swapping'.A scratched one will leave you with a worthless set of 'coasters' & be slower to for restoring. I backup to Ext. HD AND Flash drive BOTH-unlikely they'll both go bad at the same time. Good luck!

Post 81 of 258

Consider it from this side.

by hung0702 - 8/2/08 10:00 AM In reply to: i disagree by abhimanyu.mukherji

Yes, discs are more vulnerable to external forces than disks, but which is more likely to fail mechanically? I've never had a DVD fail on me the way a HDD has. You can keep two DVD copies: one for everyday use and one for storage in case the everyday DVD breaks; then make another copy so you can repeat this cycle. This is much cheaper than having multiple HDDs. The only benefit of backing up on HDD vs discs is convenience. It's easier to transfer and extract files to HDDs, but if you plan on using an external HDD often, you better plan on getting a backup for that backup.

The most reliable method—if you really need to transfer large amounts of data often—is to have one internal drive, one external, and a storage DVD. I personally use one internal and keep a storage DVD, using WIFI/flash drives/online storage to transfer data too large to email (I rarely transfer any single file larger than a 700 MB movie). Besides, Verbatim and other good brands will consistently last for years, while a HDD could last anywhere from 10 minutes to 10 years.

Post 82 of 258

Gold ( Bottom,Non-Label Side ) CD-R's

by Winchester257 - 8/28/08 7:26 AM In reply to: i disagree by abhimanyu.mukherji

I recommend " Archival Gold " CD-R's which will last nearly 300 years based on accelerated aging tests.An " Archival Gold " DVD +- R will last nearly 100 years.These discs are made by MAM-A (Mitsui),Delkin Devices (E-Film) as well as a handful of other brands.Many may be re-branded but,the key is the fact that they are archival gold discs.There is actual gold in these discs that resists the oxidation caused by the earth's atmosphere.The color of the top of the disc does not matter,it is the color + make up of the recording side.You pretty much need to order these either over the phone or over the internet.Circuit City used to sell (re-branded) Memorex Gold Archival discs (CD-R & DVD-R) but,they were over-priced.That's the only time that I've ever seen any in any retail store.For quality recordable discs check out encoredataproducts.com and datamediastore.com .

There are now also Archival Gold Blu-Ray recordable discs from Delkin Devices which hold 25 GB per single layer disc.A 50 pack spindle of these (though not cheap) gives you more storage than a 1 TB hard drive.TDK Blu-Ray recordables are cheaper and great as well but they may not last as long as the more expensive Delkin Devices Archivasl Gold BD-R.There are also 50 GB double layer BD-R's though not yet in Archival Gold.They are even working on enormous five or even ten layer Blu-Ray discs.

These are not vinyl records.You can read them multiple thousands of times before they wear out.This is more times than anyone would ever use a disc.

The key here though is that you have control over making the disc last (once you get the appropriate archival gold disc) ,unlike the hard drives etc..The discs do not scratch themselves.Someone has to scratch them.Many archival discs have an extra scratch protection layer as do (I'm pretty sure) all Blu-Ray's and BD-R's.If you handle these discs properly,they will outlast any of us.Just use a storage case,and if needed > a non-abrasive lint free cloth and never touch the bottom data side : hold the discs by the edges and/or plastic center ring.If you follow these three rules,you will never have to worry about the archival discs.To be completely safe,you can burn a back-up and even a third copy incase an important disc is lost.

Post 83 of 258

Assume that any media you use will fail

by husky91 - 8/2/08 10:09 AM In reply to: Hard disc backup, CD/DVD better for critical items by ricky_d15

This basic assumption will protect you. If you assume that any hard drive will fail, be sure to have two backups. Also, don't forget about off-site storage (in the event of a fire/flood, etc). Keep your second backup off-site. If you work in an office with any kind of locked file cabinet, just bring the off-site drive to work. Create a recurring reminder in your calendar to bring the drive home once a month to update it and you are set. At worst, you lose a month of data. Do it more frequently if you like but I find once a month to be manageable.

Post 84 of 258

Best Backup Media

by scheele - 8/12/08 10:30 AM In reply to: Assume that any media you use will fail by husky91

I keep two copies of my archived data - one on a hard drive and one on a DVD. Much has been said about the un-reliability of hard drives but DVDs are much worse! CDs are much better but do the math - how many CDs would it take to backup a tera-byte of data.

I use my external hard drives in a write-once, turn-off mode and hope for the best.

Steve

Post 85 of 258

Hard disc backup, CD/DVD better for critical items

by Lee-Mann - 8/3/08 3:00 PM In reply to: Hard disc backup, CD/DVD better for critical items by ricky_d15

My 2 cents - Lately I had 2 Exterinal Maxtor 160gig USB HDs that just lost there Partition. Tried everything but couldn't recover them. Never had this happen before. Any one no why this happened or is it just HDs going bad. I was able to add new Partion & format them but now I am worried if I use these HDs as backup drives the same thing might happen.

Post 86 of 258

ha

by nufah - 8/5/08 11:53 AM In reply to: Hard disc backup, CD/DVD better for critical items by ricky_d15

maybe Western Digital is the problem.

Post 87 of 258

External Hard Drives are not the best backup!

by An2n_eD - 8/2/08 7:57 AM In reply to: CD is the failsafe by gifro10

thanks guys.. now i'm aware..

Post 88 of 258

CD & DVD corrupt very easily

by Parkeee - 8/2/08 4:03 PM In reply to: External Hard Drives are not the best backup! by An2n_eD

I started by backing up on CDs and then DVDs. I have lost so much stuff from "long file name errors" and scratches. Worse of all I did not know that certain things never backed up.

Hard drives definitely crash. As such you must keep more than 1 to insure no loss. At this point External hard drives are so cheap that I can buy 2 500GB backup seagate drives for under $200. I keep one at home and one at the office. Sooner or later 1 will fail but they are rarely used and it should be a long time. At which point I will replace it for under $100. Even then for $1,000 you could recover it.

I have found backup programs to be confusing in their automation, especially if you are backing up to multiple disks. It is much easier to access and compare external hard drives.

I use a simple program called synchronize-it. It works great.

Post 89 of 258

CD & DVD corrupt very easily

by jopower - 8/5/08 4:45 PM In reply to: CD & DVD corrupt very easily by Parkeee

I know what you mean... from another side. I often try to resurrect other peoples CD/DVD's. Why must they try to play frizbee with them?! I can clean nearly anything on the surface but bad scratches require a trip to a local pawn shop that resurfaces discs for $4 each. It doesn't always work either.

Disc Handling Rules: Print and Post

Let's spread the word... treat your discs exactly like a pristine audiophile vinyl record at the Smithsonian Institute:

0. Clean the drive tray of dust and dirt regularly. ONLY use a good drive cleaner disc to clean the laser.
1. Fingers OFF the data surface! Handle by using the edges, center hole and label areas only.
2. Put the disc directly onto the drive tray without scraping or sliding the data surface on any edges. Slot drives: insert straight in and remove pulling straight out (I don't like slot drives).
3. Make sure the disc is properly centered in the tray before closing.
4. Always move the disc to a sleeve or cover from the drive without laying it down and vice-versa.
5. Do not leave the disk exposed to dust, sun or heat (in or out of cover).
6. Entropy exists! A Murphy's Law states that any fragile item's damage is directly proportional to it's altitude above the floor and that it will always land on the most damaging location (ie: under a moving foot or on fresh bubble gum or gritty sand).
7. Store in solid stable container away from danger.
8. Only AOL discs shall be used as a coaster or frizbee.

My CD handling tip: I've used my pinky in the center hole and thumb at the edge to load a disc with no problems for 25 years.

Post 90 of 258

CD Frisbee

by RippyT - 8/5/08 9:21 PM In reply to: CD & DVD corrupt very easily by jopower

I am amazed at how many times I see my friends leisurely mishandle discs in such a haphazard way, and break practically all the rules that Jopower listed. Many is the time I've had somebody burn me a disc and hand it to me full of scratches and shmutz. When I usually get a disc from someone, I burn a new copy, or just put the files right on my hard drive immediately.

I'd like to add one more rule to that Jopower�s list: Never lend discs which you don't have a duplicate of to friends�or anybody else for that matter. Don't even bring the disc to that friend�s house so he can copy it while you are over there. Always make a copy for that person yourself instead. Never trust anybody with you data but yourself.

Also, if you insist on using burnable optical media for storage or backup purposes, always make at least two copies. And store the copies in a different place. Always create checksums for all the files you intend to burn, include the checksum file on the disc, and then run a verification of the checksums before you consider the copy done. It�s also a good idea to run a surface scan of the disc as well just to be extra-safe.

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