Home audio & video: did you get a Calibration? and Why?
did you get a Calibration? and Why?
by gabereyes - 3/17/08 9:50 PMI know there is alot of reasons to get your TV calibrated by a professional, but I would like to know if you all got one, and if so why?
Thanks
gabe
Video Calibration
by jasondtx - 3/18/08 9:24 AM In reply to: did you get a Calibration? and Why? by gabereyesI own a home theater store and yes you should get your tv or projector calibrated! Tv's and projectors are very inaccurate right out of the box. Usually color temperature from the factory is pushed into the red or blue spectrum which makes the picture more bright and colorful. This in turn makes you more likely to purchase the set on a showroom floor because it is brighter and more vivid than the one next to it. After calibration the set will usually be lowered in overall brightness but colors will be very even, nothing will stick out more than it should. Flesh tones looks better, blacks usually look blacker, improves grayscale, it also improves the life of the set because it's no longer set to "burn your retina" mode. Take a movie like Lord of the Rings, or something with dark scenes in it. Watch a scene on a calibrated set, then watch the same scene on a non calibrated set like a sony. Sonys are very far off from the factory, and you should notice a big difference.
i'm still confused on this subject...
by bean99 - 3/18/08 11:22 AM In reply to: Video Calibration by jasondtxhaven't had my panny plasma calibrated.
i mean, we're talking about adjusting the settings, right? i cannot understand why i'd pay $200 - $300 to hire someone to adjust my tv settings. do they do something besides what's available on the menu that you can access with the remote?
for what it's worth, i called panasonic and they said there is no need to calibrate, that it is "done at the factory."
yes
by jostenmeat - 3/18/08 11:28 AM In reply to: i'm still confused on this subject... by bean99they go into your service menu. You might find out how to do that yourself at AVS, or perhaps Gabe can tell you, but its not encouraged for noobies since you might destroy your tv. usually a "secret" series of codes/buttons.
A calibration disc is a nice compromise for a lot less money.
i imagine...
by bean99 - 3/18/08 11:36 AM In reply to: yes by jostenmeatthey get into my service menu by pressing some combo of numbers on the remote and / or tv itself that i otherwise wouldn't press?
why *wouldn't* the factory do this for us? wouldn't they want the best image displayed to sell more screens?
also-- i imagine with a calibration disk i don't have to get into my own service menu? that i can just do it with the remote?
i'm assuming when you say "service menu," it's something different than the usual "sharpness, color, contrast," etc. menu that comes up easily with the remote control.
calibration
by jasondtx - 3/18/08 12:13 PM In reply to: i imagine... by bean99A test disc is a good start, it gets you about half way there. An ISF calibration lets you do a color balance on the set. It is done in the service menu of the tv (something the manufacturer doesn't let the consumer know of because you can really mess up your tv if you don't know what you're doing). You hook up a color balancer to the tv, it looks like a hockey puck that sticks to the front of the tv screen. It measures color temperature and they are a very expensive piece of equipment. You then put up different test patters on the screen and the color balancer connects to a computer and tells you on a graph where your color temp is and where it should be. Then, in the service menu you can individually adjust red gain, red cut, blue gain, blue cut, green gain, and cut. Your goal is to achieve a 6500 degree kelvin color temp setting which is what any studio or broadcast is set to. Once you have this done it makes a big difference in the quality of picture you see.
great answer
by bean99 - 3/18/08 12:54 PM In reply to: calibration by jasondtxthanks!
so who's done it, and did you *really* notice a difference? i mean, you're not just saying you did so you can save face on your $200? it's okay to admit if you didn't notice an improvement...
Calibration
by jasondtx - 3/18/08 1:46 PM In reply to: great answer by bean99I own a home theater store and have done it many times. All of our sets and projectors are calibrated that way we can show customers the real differences between them. Yes it makes a nice and noticeable difference!
Calibration-do you need it?
by dilbertzoolander - 3/23/08 7:39 AM In reply to: great answer by bean99I have a Pioneer FHD1 monitor and out of the box, it was pretty accurate. But a professional calibration made the picture noticeably better, especially with grayscale performance. My technician used some very good equipment that 99.9% of people will not be able to use. He was able to calibrate for both Day and Night settings (bright or dark room essentially), and got the colors dead on. I highly recommend a pro calibration for best performance. I paid $295 in Chicago, and it took about 90 minutes. Just make sure the tech is ISF certified.
DVE HD
by kuliddar - 3/21/08 11:24 AM In reply to: calibration by jasondtxI have a Panny Plasma and although the factory settings are ok, they can be much better IMO. Unfortunatly, I have yet to find a setting that I like hence I pre-ordered from amazon the DVE HD: Blu-ray edition disc fo 18.95$US. This should give a good base for any future tweaks. I'll try to remember to post my results once I receive the disc. It comes out officially on the 25th of this month.
Calibrating TVs.
by msd1107 - 3/21/08 8:06 PM In reply to: calibration by jasondtxThere is a consumer affordable calorimeter so that many end users can calibrate their own TV. It is Datacolor SpyderTV.
Several years ago I got a Sony KD34XBR960 and calibrated it with the SpyderTV. While the Sony was close as delivered, the calorimeter made some subtle changes that were noticable to me. And best of all, it gives a printout so you know just how close to perfect the TV is (some TVs still have noticable errors even after calibration.)
And remember, the calibration changes depending on the lighting conditions in the room. So if you are a stickler for optimum adjustments, you will calibrate the TV for dark and light conditions and set the TV as appropriate.
Also, you probably should check the calibration annually to compensate for the TV ageing.
David
Panasonic's answer person may have been misinformed...
by Hi-def Jeff - 3/23/08 11:51 AM In reply to: i'm still confused on this subject... by bean99According to my research, "gross" calibration is what is done at the factory. In other words, the TV is assembled and tested so that is meets operating parameters, but a color calibration is not done. (CRT's (cathode ray tube) and plasmas need 100 hours of run time for the phosphors to "settle in" BEFORE they are calibrated.)
Then, the TVs are readied for the store sale environment. This involves a perversion of the settings. The contrast is moved to 100%, brightness may also be moved to the high end of the scale. Many TVs have a setting called "Vivid" or "Dynamic". These settings, and the others, are to combat the brightness in a store and to be bright to attract us to the TVs...like moths to a candle flame. But be careful and don't get burned! Vivid and Dynamic settings are HD thieves, don't use them! Use natural or better yet, calibrate your TV.
Look at it this way...detail is about small differences, subtle differences, and HDTV is all about being able to see the details. Contrast means differences. Low contrast means little differences and high contrast, big differences. If we want true to life HD, we want the correct amount of differences which is nearer 50 on the TV's contrast scale, nearer the middle of the TVs scale. (For the average home use, sight unseen, 50-60 contrast, depending on ambient light.)
Fine detail also comes from the subtle differences of color. It is the subtle shading and small differences in ONE color that make up fine detail.
Detail doesn't emerge from gross differences in color. Gross differences in color gives objects in a picture their distinction from one another. The green of the golf course or the white of the ball, for example. The details, however, come from subtle differences. Subtle differences of shading, tone, and intensity of green is what produces the individual blades of grass. Subtle differences in shading, tone, and intensity of white is what produces the dimples on the golf ball.
No TV can produce a highly detailed picture if the color mix is wrong. The look of "reality you can touch" comes from realistic representations of the colors that make up a picture.
Having said that, I am completely sold on color calibration and correct picture enhancement settings as a necessity to great quality HD. I am not completely sold on the expense of an ISF certified calibration. If you have a good eye (you've seen "WOW" HD and you know what you're looking for) and a little patience you can do color calibration.
Help and resources are found here:
http://www.wowvision.tv/main.htm
Highdef Jeff
http://www.wowvision.tv
"If your HDTV doesn't make you say "WOW!"...
let me add alittle more here
by gabereyes - 3/18/08 9:06 PM In reply to: did you get a Calibration? and Why? by gabereyesI have my TV calibrated already and I love it.
I was trying to see what made people buy one, and what made you want it?
I have to sell them at work, and it seems to be one of the hardest things to do.
customers will buy a monster cable, warranty, and power center, before a calibration, but in my eyes calibration makes the biggest diffrents in picture quality, but yet it is the last thing people get.
Im just trying to find the key points of a calibration poeple want to hear opposed to a 30min demo over calibrations.
I do understand all the value pieces behind calibration, like better colors, black and white detail, VSM off, and in some cases saves power and life span of the TV, etc.
But would like to dum it down a bit.
thanks
gabe
gabe the concept is foreign to most of us...
by bean99 - 3/19/08 7:06 PM In reply to: let me add alittle more here by gabereyeswhy would anyone spend over $200 on adjusting the darn settings?
on a crt tv, you just adjusted through the menu and were good to go.
the concept that the factory would not allow consumers to do this at home on their own is foreign to them. (i still don't understand why they wouldn't).
furthermore, most of us figure the flat screens in the store are on vivid settings, and look pretty good, so we could tinker at home and make them better.
finally, most consumers are probably happy with the image without calibration. my plasma is not isf calibrated, but looks great.
so why would i calibrate it?
(i'm just trying to give you the consumer side of it and why you may have trouble selling calibrations at work).
I understand
by gabereyes - 3/19/08 9:06 PM In reply to: gabe the concept is foreign to most of us... by bean99but CRT is one of the hardest TVs to calibrate, but no one knows this.
To me it just seems silly to spend $2000 on a new HDTV and 10-30 a month for HD service, and have it all screwed up by using the wrong settings.
I just want to help people understand that this is what makes a TV look real, some think it a personal prefrence, but its not its science and how the human eye sees everything.
its not only calibration that makes it hard, its TVs alone, customers see a cheaper TV that is brighter and think its better then the higher dollar one.
thanks for your feed back
gabe
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