Community Newsletter: Q&A: Photo inkjet printers vs. color laser printers
- 11/9/07 8:26 AM
cost of inkjet printing of photos
by ronlin81940 - 10/26/07 10:39 PM In reply to: Cost per photo by gandhawkI have read a number of the submissions concerning Edward H request for comparison of laser to injet printing of Photos. I have for a number of years printed many of my own photos and compared the quality of laser to injet printing. I have done my comparisons in stores so I do not own a laser printer. I have owned Epson Stylus Photo, lexmark,HP and currently own an Epson R300 Photo printer which I use for general printing, Photo printing and CD/DVD disk printing on printable CD/DVD disks. I used the Stylus photo for approximately 3 years with only one major problem (at near the 1 year point)which I had to contact Epson about. Epson repaired the printer and had it back to me within a week at no cost to me shipping or otherwise. The 2 Lexmarks I had, went through ink like there was no tomorrow costing me plenty in ink cost I attempted to use bulk ink but found that once their cartidges ran out the printer would no longer recognize them even though full. I have had 3 HP printers (photo class). Even though I got more pages/cartidge than the lexmark, it was still costly. I did not have good results trying to refill the cartidges.
A friend introduced me to the Epson R300 with a continuos inking system (CIS). I purchased one, then bought the CIS unit which came with a filled 6 compartment bulk ink tank feeding the replacement cartidges. I have had the unit 2 years refilled the compartments twice since then. I have printed thousands of documents and hundreds of CD/DVDs as well as at least a hundred, all sized Photos 4X6 through 8X10 in varying formats, in that time saving myself at least $300.00 in ink costs.
I obtained the CIS unit from the following website:
http://yhst-81766512513652.stores.yahoo.net/index.html
I understand now that they have CIS units available for a number of Epson and HP printers.
Hope this helps.
Duplex printers
by svea - 10/26/07 9:12 PM In reply to: None of the above by isisdaveI have tried duplex inkjets with good results but find that my main use for this feature is in black and white. Could you recommend any lasers or others for home use having the ability to duplex?
Inkjet vs Color Laser
by jwellman - 10/26/07 6:45 PM In reply to: Photo inkjet printers vs. color laser printers by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
As a professional photographer I moved from film to digital two years ago. I sent my work out to a professional lab for processing until March when I purchased an Epson 7800.
For me, inkjet is the only choice. I have 100's of different types of papers I can use. The paper choices for lasers are limited because the printing process demands smooth papers. Inkjets don't.
You can buy an inexpensive printer for less than 200 bucks that will give you quality prints for about 35 cents each. Inks and papers will give you about 50+ years of longevity depending on how you care for the photograph.
You can debate the costs all day, but when it comes down to the choices ... it is all about how you want to use the photographs and your budget.
If it boils down to the money? Send them to snap fish, walmart, or other service and you don't need to buy the equipment.
Phaser
by mchinsky - 10/26/07 7:00 PM In reply to: Inkjet vs Color Laser by jwellmanThere is another choice than Laser and Inkjet and that is the Unique Xerox (previously Tektronix) Phaser printers (note, some odd Xerox models are called Phaser, but are actually laser).
Phaser melts blocks of crayon like wax to print. The newer models like the 8560n which I got at Costco.com for $499 delivered, produce near Inkjet quality photos with almost unnoticeable dithering unlike the older models.
The images and text have a "waxy" raised fee. Some people don't like that on text, but i do. On photos, they make photos printed on cheap copier paper look the same as photos printed on an inkjet using expensive photographic paper.
Cost per page is about .09/page for a full color photo and black and white is the same as a bw laser. Their new 8860 model is 3x more expensive but not physically much different. However it uses a new wax formula that essentially makes the cost per page identical to b&w laser so they have to make up for not killing you on ink via the cost of the printer.
I still keep a Cannon i9100 for that occassional, gotta have it now high quality 4x6 or 11x17 photo (but I can take out a mortgage for that ink and paper). For my volume 4x6 printing I use Winkflash for like .11/printing.
Phaser isn't for real low volume situations. It's not a physical problem but the printer needs to keep the ink melted in a resovoir so it puts out alot of heat for rare occasional home use.
speed
by mchinsky - 10/26/07 7:02 PM In reply to: Phaser by mchinskyI forgot to mention in draft mode the 8560n can print 30ppm (try that with an inkjet) and even in enhanced quality it is about 20ppm. I can print a 2200x1600 color photo in about 9 seconds from the time the printer starts to receive data.
This is about 5 minutes on my i9100 at similar quality. That picture is about 9 cents cost.
Phaser...Phaser...Phaser!
by cfarrish - 10/27/07 4:18 PM In reply to: Phaser by mchinskyI'm with you - the Phaser is an amazing color printer. I used to work in an inner city neighborhood agency where the buildings were dingy. Printing pix of the buildings with the Phaser made them jump off the page! It was great for b/w printing too. The printer duplexed too, so it was handy - though it stumbled on heavier paper. You just could use the printer on cd labels, as the ink could melt inside a player.I now work at a place with a color laser. Some of the output is great, but the printer stumbles on large blocks of solid color. I'd to get a Phaser in here & would love one at home!
Inkjet vs Color Lazer
by gandhawk - 10/26/07 7:04 PM In reply to: Inkjet vs Color Laser by jwellmanNo one has mentioned the inkjet printers that use the Continuous Ink System(CIS). These systems have large ink reservoirs outside the printer that hold ten times the amount of ink and are connected directly to the ink cartridges inside the printer. I use a CIS for my Epson Rx580 printer and paid $65 including the ink(about 10 refills of all 6 colors). You can buy the CIS online or on Ebay. 8 X 10 Photographs use pennies worth of ink without any loss of photo quality. I can buy refill ink equivelant to ten sets of cartridges for $30.
Inkjet vs Color Lazer
by ssratt - 10/26/07 9:40 PM In reply to: Inkjet vs Color Lazer by gandhawkThere are also LED printers (Okidata) that are as good as laser printers, and run a little cheaper.
Color wise, 3 cartridges C,Y,M as well as Black
60,000mth duty cycle
2,000/5,000 page cartridges
BEST PART
you can get the high capacity (5K SET) (all) for $140
For photos I recommend a good inkjet (thermals? not sure on $/per) photo printer/paper
The 5200 is $450+ but I was able to get mine "re-furbished" for $300
HP has a B&W Laser for under $100
If it was me I would I would go with a "photo/regular" inkjet for photos and a B&W laser for regular printing
Even with my Color Laser, I'm thinking about a inkjet for photos
Fading
by Owl - 10/26/07 10:10 PM In reply to: Photo inkjet printers vs. color laser printers by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
One thing that I didn't see was the problem of fading. Many inkjet inks fade very fast if exposed to bright light or sunlight. In that case a laser print in a year will look much better then the inkjet.
Fadding
by fergusbp - 10/27/07 4:50 AM In reply to: Fading by OwlEpson has new printers that use pigment ink, and photos last for a 100 to 200 yrs. Echostore.com has Continious Ink Systems and Refillable Cartiages for many printers. They sell dye, pigment and sublimal ink in bulk. Dye ink is 100 ml for $8.99. For Canadians they ship for the US prices out of Toronto and I ussually get a shipment in 3 days from ordering date by mail and u can track the order.
Also, if u use dye ink and the proper photo paper, those prints will last for around 20 yrs. or more.
Re: FADING of inkjet photos
by frustrated bigtime - 11/24/07 8:18 PM In reply to: Fading by OwlThe Kodak AIO printers use pigment ink to produce archive quality prints that are supposed to last a hundred years. Besides not having the ink melt and run off the page when it gets wet like an inkjet. And the lowest cost per print that I'm aware of.
Opinions on COST from an industry insider
by Laserman88 - 10/27/07 4:58 AM In reply to: Photo inkjet printers vs. color laser printers by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
I sell printer supplies and have thougth a lot about supplies cost issues for my customers:
If you print a lot, the real cost of a printer is the supplies: a ream of paper per week is 100K pages in 4 years. If your printer costs 5 cents per page for the toner vs. 0.5 cents per page, that's $5000 vs. $500 for toner or ink. I suggest,
1. whether you go with inkjet or laser for color, do buy an economical black and white laser printer for your utility printing.
2. don't buy a cheap new B&W laser printer--the toner cost will be approaching 5 cents/page. get a full size refurbed B&W laser printer: the cost per page for a HP Laserjet 1012 is 4.5 cents. for a Laserjet 4050 it is 1.2 cents. buy refurb cartridges and you're near 0.6 cents. that's a factor of 9, folks.
3. buy your refurbed printer locally with a 12 mo. warranty--so you don't get junk. Ask if it has new OEM paper pickup rollers and new OEM fuser sleeve assy installed. If not, keep shopping. Such a networkable Laserjet 4050 w. 32MB extra memory and 10K rated reman. toner cartridge should be under $300.
3. estimating the cost of your color printing is difficult. HP has an excellent web page to help with that: http://www.hp.com/sbso/productivity/color/print_cost_calc.html
Not only can you calculate break even points, from this data, to decide if you should buy a bigger color laser printer, but,
4. you can also see that there are some inkjet printers that are more economical for supplies than laser printers! Check the Officejet K550! Why does HP not advertise this? I think they'd rather nobody think in terms of supplies price-per-page.
5. paper makes all the difference in quality of inkjet photo printing. for great photos on an inkjet printer, buy 100 pages of Staples Brand glossy photo paper--works out to about 30 cents per page for the paper. if you buy smaller quantities of HP or Kodak brand it is more like a buck per page.
Re - Opinions on COST from an industry insider
by Jillnjase - 11/25/07 1:52 AM In reply to: Opinions on COST from an industry insider by Laserman88Yes you are correct, but if one is frugal and watches out for good specials (as I do) then you can cut the cost of the paper significantly. Here in NZ we do not have the Staples brand but I buy only Premium Photo Paper, and I also get a box of 50 A4 free when I buy a cartridge for my HP3110 (which is rated as Premium and I am very impressed with the quality). I print at max resolution and print a 6x4 for less than 20 cents, which I am totally happy about as by printing my own pics a get far superior photos, and I get them right now. I feel that if one buys the right printer (like an HP printer that recycles the ink during the cleaning cycle) then the printing costs are not too outrageous. I could buy a continuous ink system for my printer, but why??? By the time you pay for the system etc then there is no great advantage, and what about the quality??? I print more photos than most people, and if i were to significantly increase my printing then I certainly would go the Kodak way with the pigment inks. Oh, also for those who have remarked on inkjet colours running I am not in the habit of washing my photos 
so I don't have a problem with the ink running :))
Think Quantity, Quality and Purpose. Brand is important too.
by a9fc - 10/27/07 5:58 AM In reply to: Photo inkjet printers vs. color laser printers by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
Hi, I believe my experience in selling printers can help.
I will first answer questions directly, then I will put in my own insight.
Q.How do color laser printer fare as compared to inkjet printers when it comes to printing photos?
A. At the highest setting, Inkjet's quality reign supreme. As its name suggest, photo inkjets are designed to print photos. For normal uses though (when photo quality isn't needed), it will depend on the brand of your printer as I have seen huge differences in colour quality between the brands. Understand that I am not a promoter for a single brand. I can earn from any purchase that the customer makes.
At normal settings however, and on plain paper, the higher end lasers give a better printout.
Q.Will color laser give me the quality of an inkjet printer?
A. As of now, lasers will only print photo-like printouts, not photo quality.
Q.How about cost per page for color laser over inkjet?
A. Though the initial cost of laser printers are higher, if you do a lot of printing, lasers win hands down in terms of cost per page. However, if you are really really picky about the quality differences between inkjet photos and lser colour printouts, then it justifies spending a little more on the ink for inkjets.
Q. What are some of the tradeoffs going to a color laser printer for photos? And are their any downsides to laser?
A. Comparing with the best laser colour printout in my experience, there is only a slight difference in terms of quality and finish. If I had to give a number, the inkjets will probably score 15% better in terms of quality and finish.
Downsides: high initial cost, bulkier, can't print 'photo' photos.
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I did a test with 1 sample photo on the different brands of laser printers. Unlike inkjets, where the difference in quality is negligable, the differences in lasers are, comparatively, glaring.
Best: HP, Cannon
Worst: Samsung
The rest fall in between. It was repeated by one of my more savvy customers who is a professional printer using his own sample and he came up with the same results.
The better laser printers do give a glossy finish on plain paper, which is quite remarkable.
That being said, as of right now, with todays tech, you can't print photos on lasers. Period.
However, if you are more interested in colour documents, can compromise on the 10-15% drop in quality and intend to print multitudes of it, then get a laser.
In summary:
Photo Quality: Inkjet
Normal Quality: Laser
Plain Paper Colour: Laser
Glossy Paper Colour: Inkjet/Laser (note, lasers use LASER glossy paper)
Photo Paper: Inkjet (note, no lasers accept photo paper)
Speed:Laser
Initial cost: Inkjet
Long term cost (low usage): inkjet
Long term cost (high usage): laser
There are actually a lot of variables to consider. There are no straight answers and it actually really depends on your needs. Most importantly, talk to a few salespeople, do your own research and keep testing until you find the one which is suitable for you.
a little more..
by a9fc - 10/27/07 6:21 AM In reply to: Think Quantity, Quality and Purpose. Brand is important too. by a9fcWould like to add a few more things:
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Whenever a sales person talks about a toner or catridge being able to print XX number of pages, it is based on a 5% coverage.
Ever wonder why toners and catridges seem to run out before they reach their advertised numbers? ^^
Example: ZZ black toner can print 2000 pages. If you print a lot of full page black documents, you would divide 2000 by 20. So, the same toner can print 100 full black pages.
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Just an observation: Many of my HP customers stay with HP, while the others are constantly swtiching around.
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In most cases, what you pay for is what you get. Like when I mentioned that Samsung was had the worst printout, it was also the cheapest to get. Even though it is the most affordable, the printouts are so bad that I am willing to condemn it in a public forum.
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For laser printers: fo a 'fold test' on the printout. You will note that the ink on the cheaper lasers tend to fall out, leaving a crease with patches of white. (guess which brand's printout does that? it's notthe only one. have fun testing ^^)
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ALWAYS factor in the costs of toners/catridges. It is a common trick to sell printers dirt cheap only to have the consumables burn holes in pockets later.
Lasers: Some companies now have a toner+drum combo. Don't be put off by the slightly higher prices. If you do your calculations, it's actually much cheaper as there won't be a 'drum ambush', where you'd fine yourself suddenly spending a new printer's worth of money to replace the drum.
Inkjets: Only get bulk if you really print a lot. Inks in inkjet catridges have been known to literally dry up or harden when left unused for a long period of time.
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