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Car Tech: Poll: What nationality's carmakers build the better car?
- 6/20/07 3:42 PM
heres mixing cars and controversy
by ldsaint - 6/24/07 10:04 AM In reply to: What are you asking really? by ldsaintAt the end of my post I typed something that appears now as ***, i am sure i typed "***" is there something offensive about abbrieviating japanese. I am English but i get called Brit or limey and various other names. The only offensive abbreviation i can think of is for pakistani's and I understand why with them. Honestly the constituants of the british isles have been shortening names and taking the mick out of each other for years and the rest of the world should lighten up, there's nothing derogatory or offensive to be found.
Having read more on the posts here it would be nice to see if india can give us a quality product. whilst bettering the life of the people who build them. We don't want them cheap at the expense of human rights.
It's quite funny reading some of the posts as most seem to be written by consumers, and/or patriots. if i am the only mechanical technician here then only my point of view is valid lol.
So here's the last thing i have to say on it all... Best car at the moment...lexus. best car of all time Rolls Royce. Best 4x4 probably toyota, best 4x4 of all time land rover. For those patriotic die hard americans, stop polluting the earth with gas guzzlers build better quality bodies so they resist the great british weather, then sort out the useless soft suspension. You do have the money and the ambition to be the best but you have so much pride and love for money you forget to do the little things like stop poverty in the states and rebuild new orleans. We brits would love americans more if only a few more of your leaders practiced what they preach. Chrysler and jeep are growing in popularity here so anythings possible if you try.
Have a nice day.
No Australian cars?!
by kiplinght - 6/21/07 6:15 AM In reply to: Poll: What nationality's carmakers build the better car? by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
Where is the aussie car option, we aussies export heaps of cars. I would have thought that we make more cars than say... the swedish.
Australian cars are built to very high quality standards. We win, even if the poll doesn't say so :P
Simple, anything BUT american.
by n-telligence.com - 6/21/07 6:19 AM In reply to: Poll: What nationality's carmakers build the better car? by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
The best quality cars are made in Germany. Best quality for the price in Japan. The worst cars in almost all areas are American. With the possible exception of Russian cars, but who the hell buys Ladas?
Here's my ranking of the major countries (based on quality and nothing else).
9. Russian
(Lada just isn't even a car, they are very cheap boxes of crap though).
8. American
(they fall apart after a few years, can't turn when in speed because of ****** suspension, most of them look either moderate or bad, they all have low quality plastic in them, and it's put together badly. The biggest problem with American cars is really that they thing that bigger means more luxurious, and it just doesn't. Also, most of them are insanly bad for the environment).
7. Korean
(I don't really know that much about Korean cars, so i'll just stick them here because i don't like the interior quality of Kias).
6.French
(The french cars aren't very good in quality, but they are cheap, and the quality is acceptable, some of them even look good, so they get 6th).
5. Italian
(Now this is not about style, where they would be much better, but especially Alfa Romeo, Fiat and Lamborghini have a history of bad quality, but much of that have bin bought by German carmakers, which means what? total quality everywhere).
4. Brittish
(All you need to do is look at the interior quality of the Aston Martins and you know what i mean. Sweeet).
3. Swedish (volvo)
(You just can't break some of these old Volvos, they just keep driving, so that has a certain quality to it).
2. Japanese
(Japanese cars are dependable and affordable, a perfect combination, and that's also why Toyota is now the number one car company).
1. German
(German cars are ultimate quality, and at the same time most of them have luxurios interiors. If you buy a german car you just know that it wont break down on you, it'll last forever. The german car is basically a volvo that also looks and feals good).
Japanese
by josh_wludyka - 6/21/07 6:27 AM In reply to: Poll: What nationality's carmakers build the better car? by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
By far, Japan cars take the prize with honda, toyota, nissan and mazda. With quality of veichles, good prices and far better fuel economy then the rest makes these cars obviously the choice buy for consumers. The only veichle that comes to mind that can compete fuel economy wise with a car like a civic is a volkwagon jetta TDI.. which get unreal mileage however.. huge price difference. As for german made cars they are the best.. period. What kind of car can compete with a line up like BMW, Lamborghini, Audi, Porsche and Volkswagon for power, speed, quality, comfort and incredible design? Only 2 draw backs are they are ridiculously expensive; and besides volkswagon, their fuel economy is pretty much out the window with the use of v8, v10 and v12 engines. Top of the line cars tho!(Y) XD
Reminder
by josh_wludyka - 6/21/07 6:41 AM In reply to: Japanese by josh_wludykaoh by the way.. for all those who read this.. lamborghini is german now. They were bought out by Volkswagon AG. The same company that owns Volkswagon and Audi. Thats why the new 2007 Audi S8 sports the v10 engine from the lambo gallardo boared out to 5.2l from the 5.0l engine. This happens to be my personally favorite car out there. I want one so bad. Price tag keeps me waiting.
What nationality's car makers build better cars?
by margsi2 - 6/21/07 6:43 AM In reply to: Poll: What nationality's carmakers build the better car? by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
It speaks volumns to me for Honda that I have owned my Civic EX for 14 years and have around 112,000 plus on it. It was made in Canado though. I have never owned any other car more than 5 years. The only work that has been done on this car is really just maintenance. It's probably cost me the least of any car I have ever owned. It's still tight all the way around and doesn't sound rickety like American made cars I have owned in the past. I have looked at other new cars and I still want my Civic. I just don't believe there is a more reliable, economical and good looking car on the road. There is only one thing I would change and that would be to make the front seats more comfortable, especially the driver's seat.
best car builders
by blazerrb - 6/21/07 6:43 AM In reply to: Poll: What nationality's carmakers build the better car? by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
If you want to know who builds the best cars just look in a Consumer Reports magazine the Japanese they have been the best for the last twenty years.
Honda and Toyota
by anhornd - 6/21/07 6:44 AM In reply to: Poll: What nationality's carmakers build the better car? by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
According to a bar graphic on consumer reports, Honda and Toyota are the most relyable car makers. VolksWagon was last; with over 80% of thier new cars needing major repairs within the first five years. I know a guy that just bought a VW (2006). He has taken to the shop for repairs 3 times already. Just proof that the report on consumer reports is not wrong.
While we are talking about quality and relyability, Ford is said to now be making vehicles that are as high quality as Honda and Toyota. But that report just came out so I own a Honda Civic.
How about what's best for the economy?
by jdiehn - 6/21/07 7:02 AM In reply to: Poll: What nationality's carmakers build the better car? by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
I'm sorry, when did it all get lost on people that just because a few import cars are made in America, that the money stays in America.
Profits from the cars go to the country of where the company has it's corporate offices. You cannot tell me that if even just 25% of the people buying imports, that our economy would not be better. I have owned nothing but American cars, Fords to be exact, and have never, I repeat never, had a problem that happened before it's time, e.g. rebuild the transmission after 125,000 miles.
Not quite the whole picture
by dieseldrummerprl - 6/21/07 1:56 PM In reply to: How about what's best for the economy? by jdiehnSo all the money made by the US division of all these foreign car companies doesn't stay here? If that was true, the US division wouldn't be able to exist because they would have no money to do anything and to build new plants. Not to mention that all the jobs these companies provide as they continue to open up plants as domestic companies shut down plants or lay off workers has a huge impact on the economy. The Lexus branch of Toyota is even considered an American company.
These new US plants bring in more domestic suppliers, which are most likely US companies at the same time that companies like Delphi have no money and are laying off workers.
why bother about the profits ,be concerned over the cost
by arondan - 6/23/07 10:54 PM In reply to: How about what's best for the economy? by jdiehnwhat cost you say? The cost in American jobs, namely those done by the hundreds of subcontractors that truely make American goods, AMERICAN. If you go to a car store and look at the content portion of the sticker, you might be surprised to learn that on several Ford products the domestic content indicates that a good portion of the car was made or sourced somewhere else. As one example, the current Mustang has just 65% local content. Put another way, Ford chose to make the other 35% from non-American parts and/or labor to construct the vehicle. That's about $7,000.00 of the average $20,000.00 retail cost of the car that went to jobs outside the U.S. That other money is much greater than the profit Ford makes per Mustang. In a worse example, the Fusion, and its siblings, the Mercury Milan and the Lincoln MKZ, are only 30% American content, with the 70% percent of the vehicle's parts and labor sourced in MEXICO! Imagine the number of American jobs that cost. On the other hand, a look at the Toyota Camry shows a %78 percent American content listed on its sticker, In fact, Toyota employs 368 AMERICAN subcontractors to their products here, that translates into thousands of employed people empowering them to afford to send their children to college, pay their mortgages on time, afford a second vehicle,in short, keep our economy strong by supporting local businesses with their take home pay, thanks to Toyota.Imagine how many more millions of paycheck dollars would fuel our economy if Ford sourced all its subcontractor parts and labor here instead of beyond our borders? Of course there will always be those who say: "but what about the profits?" I say why should you care about 2 to 6 percent of the purchase price leaving the country? You should be glad that 94 to 98 per cent stays here fueling our country's financial infrastructure. By the way, according to federal manufacturing guidlines, in order to classified as an American product, the finished goods should be of 75% local content, meaning that brand new Mustang,Fusion, Mercury Milan, or Lincoln MKZ you just bought or maybe own, is a FOREIGN car!
Look, thats all nice and good
by Andy77e - 7/23/07 1:07 AM In reply to: why bother about the profits ,be concerned over the cost by arondanI really agree, but the answers here are a bit more complex.
You want the jobs to come back to the USA? You want part manufactures to come back the USA? You want things to be American made?
Great! But here's the issue, no one is going to buy a more expensive 'whatever' if there is the exact same thing cheaper, made by another country. No one is going to buy a broom made in the USA for $20, when they can get the exact same thing from Mexico for $10. The same is true for any product, including cars. Why do you think the Chevy Aveo is make in Korea? Because people are willing to work for less, and there are less taxes.
So that has to change. And it can... but you are not going to do it. We must drastically cut taxes. But that means we have to cut government spending. Cut social security, cut medicare/medicaid, cut unemployment comp, cut everything. Why do this? Because if you cut taxes, you can pay people less money, and yet increase their take home pay. That can drastically cut labor costs, and make it cost effective to build stuff here.
That's just one thing that has to change. There are many others. Unions are going to have to take some pay cuts. Minimum wage has to be decreased, not increased. Costly regulations have to be relaxed or made affordable.
Are you going to do any of that? No. So instead we'll all just watch jobs slowly trickle to Mexico and Korea and Japan and on and on.
Japanese, then American
by wbowblis - 6/21/07 7:07 AM In reply to: Poll: What nationality's carmakers build the better car? by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
I have no doubt that Japanese carmakers consistently produce a better product, but I question putting Germany second. In my admittedly limited experience, Japanese cars I've had have been flawless, while a 1979 VW had electrical problems that should have been avoided. I also owned a '73 Chevy that soured me on all GM products, not only because of the poor quality and reliability, but the attitude from GM reps that sums up best as "you bought it, you sap!" From what I've heard and read, U.S. automakers have vastly improved the product and I think they've passed Germany, on the average. They still produce some crap, but a lot less of it.
My observations lead me to believe a major problem Detroit has is using technology too soon and having problems with it. You won't get the latest tech glitz in a Japanese car, but what you get works reliably. Unless they've changed, the German cars I've had lag technologically. My '79 VW had points while a '76 Chrysler had electronic ignition. Trucks are another matter. Truck buyers typically aren't looking for glitz but for a workhorse vehicle, and Detroit seems to do a good job of providing that, but so does Japan and others. It's simply a different market with it's own requirements. SUVs may really be trucks, but they are produced for and sold to a "car" market and likely have the same issues as the cars from the same manufacturer. Don't expect an SUV to behave like or last like a truck.
Almost every post I read choosing American cars cites older ones. I remember when Detroit sold solid transportation rather than a living room with wheels. My father's '55 Chevy largely had the same equipment as my '59 VW beetle. The only equipment differences were the Chevy had a clock while the VW had an AM radio.
Finally, it's true that everybody builds vehicles all over the world and parts come from everywhere, so the differences have to be mostly in engineering and management. If the bottom line takes precedence, it's good for stockholders, but bad for buyers.
Japanese
by kimbo1308 - 6/21/07 7:13 AM In reply to: Poll: What nationality's carmakers build the better car? by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
Japanese car companies are technological leaders, not run by bean counters like American automakers who put short term profits first. Why does GM's Rick Wagner make $10 million a year in salary while his company loses $10 billion while Toyota's CEO makes only $900,000 in salary and his company makes $10 billion in profits. Where is a CEO today like Lee Iaccoca who took $1 in salary to save Chrysler in the early 1980s. Today's American CEOs put their yearly bonuses first ahead of what's good for the long term future of their companies.
Back in 1994 GM got a $140 million award from the Dept. of Energy to develop a hybrid vehicle. What did the taxpayers get for their money? Did it go to the bonuses of their CEO?
In 1992 SRI did a study on the prospects of electric and hybrid vehicles and concluded that hybrids would be too costly due to the need for an electric and gasoline propulsion trains. GM bean counters in 1992 saw that and said we're not going there. The engineers who run Toyota saw that as a challenge and rolled up their sleaves to make the cars cheaper. The Prius is one of the technological achievements of the 20-21st century
Pzev
best cars
by kbckc - 6/21/07 7:23 AM In reply to: Poll: What nationality's carmakers build the better car? by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
I drive a Honda. It's my fourth one since 1988. My experience is they are bullet proof. I am old enough to remember when Honda, and Japanese cars in general, were throw-away junk. Today, I cast a vote for Korean cars. The reason is I have tracked these auto products and I have seem them evolve much the same as Japanese products, except they have covered the same ground in less than half the time. Also, they have avoided some of the mistakes of earlier Japanese manufacturers by going to school on them. Koreans are hungrier than Japanese, so they are coming on strong. The new product offerings, and the long warranties coming with them, in just the last two years have been very impressive. I think Korea is the source to watch going forward. On another note, I saw in the WSJ yesterday that Toyota has "hit a wall" in building manufacturing facilities in the US. There has been an inverse relationship between increased volume and product quality, just like every other manufacturer down through history. Turns out Toyota has not found that holy grail yet either.
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