HTC
Community Newsletter: Q&A: Home audio and video: Premium vs. generic cables
- 6/15/07 6:51 AM
Component racks
by agb100 - 6/14/07 2:29 PM In reply to: Loss vs. gain [sic] by nmonroSturdiness, or stability, is just one of the issues. The more important one is the rack's immunity to reject, and not pass vibrations, the natural pass filters in all physical objects that affect certain frequencies of resonance.
Any physical object can absorb, transmit, and retain energy. In an audio system energy is transmitted through the air, the floors and walls. These impact on the component directly.
The speed of the transmission of energy into and out of the rack, or component, affects the sound, since if the energy not transmitted out of the component or rack, or if it tnot fully absorbed,he resonant energy will enter the mechanical side of the system, and dissipate internally, sometimes slowly: within the CD laser assembly, the cartridge, tonearm and turntable system, the tube filaments of tube electronics, etc.
That is why nmunro, I made fun of buying for looks. I know from experience and measurements the deleterious effects of energy you don't want in your system. Energy causes time smear...it rebounds and enters your system again and again, albeit at lower magnitudes as it decays. It does this repeatedly. What you get is distortion.
Middle of the Road
by shamarcus - 6/10/07 10:52 AM In reply to: Home audio and video: Premium vs. generic cables by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
Get your cables from the discount retailers such as Walmart and Target and get a good middle of the road cable. The best buys and circuit cities will only stock the premium monster cables. Otherwise when you buy a new TV, ask for them to throw in one of their premium cables.
Why stay in the middle
by cnetmessageman - 6/10/07 3:28 PM In reply to: Middle of the Road by shamarcusIn my previous post I mentioned the Impact Acoustics SonicWave HDMI Cable. It has excellent construction, received very good reviews, and has basically the same composition as the following "expensive" premium brands:
Monster
AR
Belkin AV Pure
Audioquest
Kimber Kable
SPECS:
Silver Plated Oxygen Free Copper Conductors
foam PE Dielectric
Triple shielding
24K gold plated contacts
You can purchase this cable online at www.overstock.com for $50 (2Meters) or $53 (3Meters) plus shipping. It is also available at PCUinverse.com for $37.29 (1Meter) + [$7.24 (S&H to Atlanta)]
Note, however, that this is the same cable that Radio Shack, CompUSA, etc. sells under the Cables-To-Go label. But if you purchase it at any of these stores will cost you about the same as the above mentioned "premium" cables which is about $100 for 2Meters.
Fine but which Oxygen Free Copper did they use?
by R. Proffitt - 6/10/07 3:41 PM
In reply to: Why stay in the middle by cnetmessageman
http://www.hitachi-cable.co.jp/catalog/CE100.pdf
Hmm, 10 types. I bet no one knows this one.
Bob
Not really sure but
by cnetmessageman - 6/10/07 11:47 PM In reply to: Fine but which Oxygen Free Copper did they use? by R. Proffitt
Thanks for the info Proffitt. If memory serves me correctly, Hitachi made the first OFC cables (audio) I bought back in the eighty's. Iand my professor at the time was very impressed particularly with HF reproduction.
I am a fan of both Continuous Casting (Cu and Ag) and Cryogenics as well as the cable manufacturers using it (Ridge Street Audio, PNF Audio, and Chris Venhaus).
I am reasonably certain that the OFC being referred to by almost all the vendors (with the above exceptions) are not of the above two types and are more likely to be in the "General" category. Otherwise I am sure these guys would advertise the fact as bragging rights which separates their product from the rest.
In particular, I would love to obtain a pair of Ridge Street Audio Poiema III interconnects but I just can't afford that luxury rioght now.
maybe I'm wrong but....
by batman823 - 6/12/07 6:28 AM In reply to: Not really sure but by cnetmessagemanmaybe I'm wrong, but I think he was referring to the type of alloy, not that the OFC may be used by other companies. The difference in alloy can make a big difference, provided it's matched with an equal counterpart for the female connector. The alloys can vary greatly in resistance. (copper is very low and resistant to corrosion) Oxygen Free really doesn't matter unless you frequently expose your connectors to chlorinated water and high temperatures or current on a regular basis. I, personally, do not water my AV equipment
of course the sales geeks are trying to make money
by One_Of_One - 6/10/07 5:39 PM In reply to: Home audio and video: Premium vs. generic cables by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
but smart users go to avsforum and learn like I did. monoprice has the hdmi cables you need for less than 8 dollars and they are the same cables you overpay for from the red shirts or the blue shirts. these cables work perfectly and its inarguable that they are of the same quality as the 50-100 dollar rip offs in the stores or online.
High quality cables at a good price
by jwlarson - 6/11/07 6:06 AM In reply to: Home audio and video: Premium vs. generic cables by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
I have been buying all my audio and video cables from Audio showcase (www.audioshowcase.com) and have been very happy with the quality. I have put them up against monster cables in a side by side comparison and I can't tell the difference. I just bought a LCD TV for our bedroom and wanted the hook my PS3 up with HDMI cable. I looked around and the best price I could find was $50 for a 6 foot cable in retail stores compared to $12.50 from Audio Showcases premium. They also sell Monster cables if your not sold on thier cables but the prices for the Monster cables are as you would expect for Monster cables. I haven't cut into one of their cables to compare the sheilding, but the thickness of the cable is the same as all those expensive brands and as I stated earlier, I could see a difference in the picture in a side by side comparison. Check them out!
My thoughts
by jerry1111 - 6/11/07 6:27 AM In reply to: Home audio and video: Premium vs. generic cables by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
I thought about this, and realized that if there was truly a difference, then the premium cable manufacturers should would set up a comparison in the store. Show one TV or stereo running with cheap cables and one running with their high-end cables, and let the consumer judge the difference. Even go so far as to set up a selection box and let the customer change among several cables to let them decide what to buy, much like selecting among speakers to choose which you want. If there truly was a difference, then this set-up would let the cables sell themselves. But I have NEVER seen such a set-up. So, I decided that there isn't much difference.
When I purchase cables I always purchase above the cheapest, but I also use cables included with the equipment, and they work well.
Manufacturers of high end cables
by agb100 - 6/12/07 11:31 AM In reply to: My thoughts by jerry1111Manufacturers of high end cables often set up demos at industry shows.
In fact.
And some of the more successful demonstrate to anyone with an open mind the superiority of better cables.
But...
In fact....
Lots of people do not have open minds when their biases force them, for their own psychological reasons, to deny the reality that all steaks do not taste the same no matter how many McDonald's fans would tell you otherwise.
All CD players (digital devices, no?) do not sound the same. All HDTV video displays do not process video signals the same (visible to anyone who ever stepped into a big box store.) The last are digital devices.
All digital cables do not transmit a digital signal the same way.
There are analogue distortions that explain the performance, or lack of, for audio cables...and yes, price alone does not determine performance. There are expensive audio cables that beat the pants off the ultra-expensive audio cables. But cheap audio cables have never surpassed in performance audio cables that costs.
There are digital distortions that explain the performance, or lack of, for digital cables....and yes, price alone does not determine performance. Again, the cheap digital cables do not surpass, or often even come close to, the performance of top notch -- and often very expensive -- digital video cables...and yes, you CAN see the differences that anyone can see unless one is blind. But that is another issue.
On the issue of buying up, rather than down, they are values judgments...not a judgment of value.
A cheap cable can be a bad value; and an expensive cable can be a good value.
A cheap car can be a poor value if it doesn't protect your life or drives like a piece of junk, or is inappropriate for your status in life...let's say a Beetle for a business executive, or a Ferrari for a real estate agent.
The best, or even the better, always cost more money than the standard, the pedestrian, the common.
This principle goes for video cables too. The best is expensive and selling it is not a fraud provided the vendor can support his case. Some vendors can; others cannot.
Radio Shack and Monster are just two brands among several hundred. they are generally at the low end of the spectrum in price and performance. When one talks about cheaper cables than Monsters, you are no longer in the basement; you are below the slab in the sub basement.
Life just ain't fair, is it?
Cabling from an other view
by Bert37 - 6/14/07 1:19 AM In reply to: Manufacturers of high end cables by agb100All the discussions about quality of audio and video cables (excluding speaker cables) are close to gossip. Everyone that ever has seen a production studio knows that there are no snake oil cables, nor oxygen free ones. These cables simply have to stand a relatively rough treatment since people often trample on them, which rarely happens in your home. Excluding rough handling in home installation, there are few things to care for, yet it is not easy for the technical unexperienced to check: Video cables must have the correct impedance and must be loaded correctly (in common 75 Ohms). You simply can hope the manufacturer of the cable AND the equipment connected have followed the rules! No snake oil, oxygen free copper, gold plated connectors can overcome any sins committed here ! With audio cables the matter is even more simple: They have to be of low capacitance. This calls for a very thin inner copper lead which may easily break under mechanical stress. Big cables with a heavy inner wire are on the wrong side anyway. Excepted are speaker cables which have to be as big as possible, but again, snake oil, freedom of oxygen may only load your pocket. As long as the the points mentioned are followed and the connectors are firmly mounted, there will be no trouble about cabling.
Better to put your money in good equipment than in exotic cables.
It's all in the connector ends, not the cable...
by robains - 6/11/07 8:38 AM In reply to: Home audio and video: Premium vs. generic cables by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
The weakest link in any connection are the actual cable ends that connect the two components together -- the connectors (be it HDMI, Component, DVI, RCA, etc.) . This is where any measurable signal degradation occurs over a realistic distance.
Only the very very very bottom end cables are suspect to signal degradation (be it digital or analog) due to no insulation and/or bad connectors.
Monster Cable (the Company) are perhaps the world's leading scam artists (do some research on the company be prepared to be shocked). Paying $300 for a 6 foot cable is hilarious -- when I see someone buy these I often wonder what their IQ is and how they managed to make enough money in the first place.
Rob
You wont see the difference or hear the difference..But..
by stealthbean - 6/11/07 11:21 AM In reply to: Home audio and video: Premium vs. generic cables by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
You will if you are looking for it. But what is the point of some minimal difference that would go un-noticed when enjoying a movie. I hate walking into "high end" audio stores and listening to all the usual tech BS. Go to radio shack and buy a 15 dollar optical audio cable and it will give you pristine sound, given that the source(dvd and dvd player) are of decent quality. Remember, the source is what is the most important factor here, i.e.. DVD/CD player and quality production of the DVD or CD. Buying expensive cables wont make a crappy system sound better. Your audio video is will only be as good as the source. I recommend allocating more on the sources. As for audio cables I reccomend buying online from sites geared towards music production, usually in their pro-audio section. The cables they offer are ones used in studios to produce audio. Personally I prefer mogami for analog rca connections. Keep your cables organized, dont mix or put power cables near signal cables. Basic things will save you alot of money and improve signal quality.
for example..
by stealthbean - 6/11/07 11:41 AM In reply to: You wont see the difference or hear the difference..But.. by stealthbeanheres two different rca cables(monster vs. mogami)
Look at pricing difference and look at rating difference. Customers who shop on these type of online stores usually are more knowledgable of audio components and studio experience. As you can see Mogami is an industry standard in audio interconnects.
Monster:
http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/Monster-Cable-Studio-Link-500-Interconnect-RCA-RCA?sku=331682
Mogami:
http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/Mogami-Pure-Patch-RCA-to-RCA-Mono-HiDefinition-Patch-Cable?sku=339032
Monster-ously Expensive
by SacredPhish - 6/11/07 11:36 AM In reply to: Home audio and video: Premium vs. generic cables by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
Get the least expensive cables you can. Most are gold plated, which is probably as are as I'd go in the way of "extras." Avoid Monster if possible, in my opinion they're overrated and overpriced.
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