Car Tech: What are the pros and cons of plastic cars?
- 6/6/07 1:57 PM
Plastic Trucks
by Kurt Saldutti - 6/9/07 1:27 PM In reply to: What are the pros and cons of plastic cars? by wcunning
The idea of plastic cars is ideal in most every way. Reusable or recyclable panels. Non dinging or denting in the every day world. No rust and always looks new compared to the tuna can tin body panels on today’s vehicles.
It just make plain good sense. So how about trucks also using plastic or composite body panels. Why not? The only metal that may be argued as needed would be the pickup bed and walls. The entire outer skin could and should be plastic. Plastic body panels are strong and in conjunction with a well designed frame and cage, they are stronger than their tin counter parts. Oh and when I say tuna can tin I mean that is all they are. You can’t even lean on a car or truck and have a conversation with someone without leaving an arm or elbow distortion in the panel. They offer zero protection in an accident and in fact may cause more damage as far as injuries then a plastic panel vehicle. I know there are still a steel lobby and unions as well as over seas steel deals that weigh heavy in what your vehicle is made from. If they offered a plastic body panel pickup with a small yet powerful diesel like a Dakota or Frontier/Tacoma I would buy it yesterday. Its time to forgo the useless tin panels and get with the future.
You define "ideal" differently than I do then.
by Andy77e - 6/9/07 9:30 PM In reply to: Plastic Trucks by Kurt SalduttiI don't want my car to disintergrate if someone hits me, or if I hit them.
Plastic does not always look new, unless you know of something different than I do. My metal doors (that I keep clean) look way better than my sisters plastic car doors.
I'm not sure what "tune can tin" you mean. I've sat on the hood of my 82 Buick without any dent. I think you are comparing the crappy paper thin metal used on a eco-nut midget mobile car to plastic. In which case the metal might be worse. But compared to older cars, or most truck/SUV metal, then the story changes. Older cars, and SUVs/trucks with lower CAFE requirements, have thicker tougher metal, and plastic isn't even a match for it. Now if you are talking about little Cavaliers and tiny Honda's, yeah that metal is so thin and weak, you got a point.
Well I can't answer for everyone else, but my 82 Buick has been hit twice. Both times the plastic car lost, big time. I don't even have a scratch from either hit. But the plastic other cars sure do. One was so messed up, it looked like a bull dogs face on the front.
You can get with the future. I'll be in my 82. You best not run into me, cause you'll lose.
that was 24 years ago
by Kurt Saldutti - 6/10/07 2:15 AM In reply to: You define "ideal" differently than I do then. by Andy77eI bet your 82 anything had better metalwork than anything made today. Trucks, SUVs and cars are made of crap tin panels. The metal is soft and very light. Ask a body shop that has been in business since say the 60s and get their take on the sheet metal panels. GM/Ford and Dodge they are all terrible. And I'm sure most Asian cars are near the same. Sorry but the sheet metal has changed and it is crap and that’s all there is to it.
I said that myself.
by Andy77e - 6/10/07 9:21 AM In reply to: that was 24 years ago by Kurt SalduttiYes, cars are made of crappy metal. I said that in another post. But the issue is, it doesn't have to be crappy metal. Case and point, my fathers Tahoe and mothers PT Cruiser went through a hail storm. The Tahoe had no damage, the PT was all messed up.
It is government regulations that force auto makers to use paper thin metal. If that was not the case, metal would not be crappy, and it would still be way safer than plastic. Plastic will never be a good replacement for decent steal.
This is way I'll likely always drive an old car. I can't stand plastic cars or cars with cheezy paper thin metal.
82 buick
by wcoffey81 - 6/21/07 10:41 AM In reply to: that was 24 years ago by Kurt Salduttithe 82 Buick made up for quality by using quantity. the more metal the better!
Trucks should be steel
by savagedude_21 - 6/20/07 8:55 PM In reply to: Plastic Trucks by Kurt SalduttiTrucks should not be plastic. If I was off-roading in the middle of no where, and if i roll my truck, i want [the panels] to bend, not crack in half, or become discolored, or lose severe body strength due to it stretching. After a roll-over, i want to be able to go home, take the panel off, and hammer it out. And if i'm towing, I want it to be able to handle the added stress. If im towing a 15,000 # goseneck, I dont want it breaking, I want it to be tough, and be able to do it over and over again..
just my $.02
Die??
by Rick1600 - 6/22/07 4:16 PM In reply to: Plastic Trucks by Kurt SalduttiOh my god, SAturns, were #1 in America. What the hell u talking about? I started discussion on Polymer bodied cars, no rust, onside panels. Take a pill Bud!!!Like rusted old cars, cool!
Unknown Facts
by mwooge - 6/9/07 4:18 PM In reply to: What are the pros and cons of plastic cars? by wcunning
Usually, the people on this forum are well informed and know their facts. Not this time. We have people saying plastic is recyclable and that it isn't. That plastic-bodied cars are more dangerous in an accident and that they aren't. That they're safer in thunderstorms and that it doesn't matter. I could go on.
Until we have a lot more accurate information than we've displayed, I don't think this discussion is going to go anywhere.
Tin no longer steel as they once where
by Kurt Saldutti - 6/9/07 5:43 PM In reply to: Unknown Facts by mwoogeI don't care what the argument is on this subject the fact is vehicle sheet panels are useless as far protection in an accident. They are pitifully weak and soft. I could cause major panel damage on any given vehicle with so-called sheet metal just by leaning on it. An elbow or a nee easily would cause expensive panel distortion without any injury to the limb and that is sad. The only protection is the skeleton underneath and that mean plastic can cover that metal work just as well as those tin panels with just as much protection if not more so. I’m looking at the resale value also would be better as far the esthetics of the body would look far better condition after years of first ownership. No dings and rust alone is incentive enough. I believe no mater what some day all vehicles will be made of some sort of re useable composite and the tin panels will be long gone no mater if anyone wants it that way or not.
True because of government regulations
by Andy77e - 6/11/07 5:09 PM In reply to: Tin no longer steel as they once where by Kurt SalduttiYes government has made it so auto manufactures have to use super thin metal. It's horrible but true. I just hate plastic because it provides no real protection.
We could use carbon fiber composite, but it is way to expensive. No ones going to pay $30K for a tiny car made from Carbon Fiber.
I really don't know of any useable material that can be re-used besides metal. Do you?
Blame the government
by mwooge - 6/13/07 11:48 AM In reply to: True because of government regulations by Andy77eThat's it! A government conspiracy! George "Big Oil" Bush wants the car companies to use oil-based plastics so is forcing them to use thin sheet metal.
> I really don't know of any useable material that
> can be re-used besides metal. Do you?
Actually, yes. But why waste a good conspiracy theory?
Not a conspiracy.
by Andy77e - 6/16/07 10:53 AM In reply to: Blame the government by mwoogeGranted I don't trust government one bit, but it's not a conspiracy. It's the law of "unintended consquences".
The conspiracy nuts are the ones who believe that automakers "must have the technology" to make a car that seats 6, has plenty of cargo space, and is safe like a tank, yet gets 60 miles per gallon.
Those people elect people who create and increase CAFE standards. Now the goal was for car makers to make better cars, but the result, instead of being super cars that do everything, are safe, and get great gasmileage, is that you end up with little tiny midget mobiles with paper thin sheet metal.
Like I posted before, my father has an SUV, and mother has a PT Cruiser. Little bit of hail, the PT is more bumpy than a zit covered teenager, and the Tahoe is solid and smooth.
Why? SUV/trucks have lower CAFE standards, so they can, and do, use thinker sheet metal that's tough.
Now back to the question: What other material is there that is useable on autos that is recycleable? Metal obviously is. But plastic and fiber glass isn't. So what's the other option(s)? I honestly do not know, so tell me.
BTW, I know of carbon fiber composite, no clue if you can recycle it, but it surely isn't affordable. I'm not paying $50K for a carbon fiber Geo Metro.
So we dont know what we are talking about
by colin1935 - 6/22/07 4:09 PM In reply to: Unknown Facts by mwoogePlease dont come to the UK you willbe too frit the aircraft will be fibreglass ,the Taxi,train buses and your hired car all fibreglass,yes also we have thunder storms...
Big Con - Cold Weather
by Blaziken - 6/20/07 8:29 PM In reply to: What are the pros and cons of plastic cars? by wcunning
Cold weather, such as what we have in the Midwest, doesn't mix with what becomes frozen, brittle, plastic. My front bumper was instantly crushed from a small bump this past winter. If it had been summer, there would have been no damage at all. I would NOT buy a plastic car!!!
Re: What are the pros and cons of plastic cars?
by pcrx_greg - 6/20/07 8:32 PM In reply to: What are the pros and cons of plastic cars? by wcunning
I am currently driving a '98 Saturn Station Wagon with a plastic body, and would highly recommend it. Nine years old and not a spot of rust anywhere. All my previous cars had large rust spots and/or holes after nine years. What a difference.
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