Car Tech: What are the pros and cons of plastic cars?
- 6/6/07 1:57 PM
What are the pros and cons of plastic cars?
by wcunning - 6/6/07 1:57 PM
In my recent column, The plastic transparent car, I wrote about increasing use of plastics in car body panels. Would you buy a car with a plastic body?
Plastic cars
by msd1107 - 6/6/07 9:14 PM In reply to: What are the pros and cons of plastic cars? by wcunning
There is nothing new about plastic (or composite material) cars.
The original Lotus Elite from 1957 used an almost 100% plastic construction. And the Lotus Elan from 1962 used a plastic body over a metal backbone chassis.
Composite materials provide many benefits, especially in designing controlled crushability for absorbing the impact loads in an accident. Conversely, a metal body deforms in a finite set of deformations, leading to non-linear g-forces applied during deceleration.
The ultimate is seen in F1 technology, where carbon fiber composite structures provide the ultimate in safe deformation and passenger protection.
Electrical Engineers Perspective
by JBL is Junk - 6/20/07 9:07 PM In reply to: Plastic cars by msd1107I'd rather be hit by lightening in a solid Faraday Cage than one with plastic holes in it!
You won't be hit...
by edge_bit - 6/20/07 9:18 PM In reply to: Electrical Engineers Perspective by JBL is JunkFirst of all, you're in all-plastic. Unless you're atop the highest mountain in a storm, you're not very likely to be hit at all.
As well, if it's grounding you want - the metal roll-cage will be more than sufficient. It should suck up all of the charge as it is higher up than you.
I'd like to see this tested, however. That one "Mythbusters" episode was interesting.
edge_bit and Mythbusters (Cars made of plastic)
by Daibad - 6/21/07 5:02 AM In reply to: You won't be hit... by edge_bitSorry edge_bit that you found Mythbusters 'interesting' I have seen only two of their programmes and they wererubbish -the last one was to 'prove' it was not possible tobe sucked out of an aircraft if the fusalage is breached. They factored in many aspects to be encountered in such an incident BUT they completely forgot (or was it merely omitted?) the effect of a 500mph wind passing the fracture. True ALL the experiment was conducted on the gropund but have you ever held a piece of paper in your hands (tried to read a map) beside an open car window -at perhaps 40 mph? Need I say more?
David Courtney.
True Scientific Research
by fritzbrown - 6/21/07 7:35 AM In reply to: edge_bit and Mythbusters (Cars made of plastic) by DaibadOf course, why didn't the Mythbusters just drive a car down the freeway with the window open?
That obviously constitutes research that isn't "rubbish"
Myth-Busters
by MrGadgetman - 1/29/09 8:16 AM In reply to: edge_bit and Mythbusters (Cars made of plastic) by DaibadYeah..., Mythbusters always gets stuff wrong. I don't know who they are consulting with when they conduct those experiments.
Plastic Cars in the DESERT.. BURN ME OR MELT AWAY!
by vgl1979 - 6/21/07 3:45 PM In reply to: Electrical Engineers Perspective by JBL is Junkwell, first of all.. I am tired of being an EQUAL victim compared to the victims of 9/11 with METAL cars here in the DESERTS of Arizona burning me all over before the air conditioner to kick in. It takes approxiametely 30 minutes for the inside of the car to cool down and everyone winds up home by then. Plastic cars, how thick is the plastic, will the PLASTIC melt in 109+ degree C weather? Will it cool faster?
Would the price change? Less , more?
Overall, I believe it would be a *GREAT* idea to have plastic cars... and I'm still waiting for more SOLAR CARS.. whats up with all of this?
sincerely,
DENISE MARIE KING
I.T. INDUSTRY MANAGER
vgl(viriigrrl) of EFNET
http://members.fortunecity.com/cryptik/recipe.htm
http://members.fortunecity.com/cryptik
Injection mouldings
by colin1935 - 6/21/07 4:32 PM In reply to: Plastic Cars in the DESERT.. BURN ME OR MELT AWAY! by vgl1979Just think of all the items in your homes that are injection moulded thats far higher than a 109d operation.
You are missing the point Plastic =fibreglass buses,trains lorries (most likly in aircraft also) been uses for over 50 years
Plastic cars
by Rick1600 - 6/21/07 5:49 AM In reply to: Plastic cars by msd1107I prefer to call them Polymer. I own a 1994 Saturn one of the best cars I've owned. I've had a few cars in my time. They do not rust, clean & shine , wax, is a breeze!!! No cons!!
Plastic vs steel, etc.
by deboernk - 6/21/07 8:42 AM In reply to: Plastic cars by msd1107Plastic is made from petroleum. Steel is not.
Steel is being recycled all of the time.
Manufacturing is in place to do that.
Rustproof steel alloys are being used in vehicles today.
Lightweight steel alloys are available and being used in vehicle manufacturing right now.
Plastic has been used in vehicle manufacture for quite some time and that practice will likely continue. More plastic seems to get added to vehicles as time goes on. But I see no reason to go overboard with that practice.
Some plastics are recyclable but many are not. Depends on how they are made and what the market is for recycling that particular type of plastic. Also, some plastics have addatives that are not easily recycled.
Use steel where it has advantages and plastic where it's benefits are the strongest.
I see no reason to use a lot of plastic in vehicle manufacture.
And, it uses up petroleum resources that could probably be better used elsewhere.
recycling practice
by batman823 - 6/21/07 9:45 AM In reply to: Plastic vs steel, etc. by deboernkMost of the plastics today are recyclable. Most of the plastics used by auto makers are made from recycled plastic or recyclable plastic. If they don't use plastic, they use cheap, flimsy sheet metal or some alloy. Any steel alloy is not lightweight. It's still steel. They just mix it with copper, nickel, tin, or ather metals to make it stronger or more flexible.
Today's use of metal is useless. Plastic would provide the same protection that the sheetmetal provides while reducing the weight. This actually does not increase the amount of petroleum used since they are made from recycled plastics.
True, andy77's 20+yr old car is made of stronger metals. But 99% of the cars out there today that use metal siding offer no more protection than the ones with plastic or fiberglass siding. In fact, composites and fiberglass are lighter than steel siding and stronger. Some can crack or become faded and brittle over age though. So there pros and cons to both.
Even if a car is made with new plastic, the car is still lighter. If the car only improves by 1mpg, over the life of the car much less petroleum is used for fuel.
The cage and frame of the cars could be made out of some foam-infused aluminum compound or other composite that is actually stronger than steel. But since steel is more readily available and cheaper than those kind of composites, I don't see that happening anytime soon.
It's kindof a mind-game though. A car's frame isn't that expensive to produce, even with a high-strength, lightweight composite. The auto manufaturers are still selling cars in upwards of $25k in the masses. So if that kind of construction were offered for around the same pricetag, why wouldn't people buy it? It would be lighter, getting better mileage. It would be stronger, less likely to break or warp. But who am I to say that? I'm just a nuclear engineer who's seen these materials in practice, not an automaker CEO.
plastic vs. steel
by wcoffey81 - 6/21/07 10:13 AM In reply to: Plastic vs steel, etc. by deboernkyou should change that to rust-resistant steel is being used. rust proof would either be in the stainless/titanium direction or toward aluminum. either direction brigs both pluses and negatives such as galvanic reaction
rust resistant vs rustproof
by deboernk - 6/21/07 3:07 PM In reply to: plastic vs. steel by wcoffey81You are probably right. But if the material lasts for 20 years or so with no real detrimental effects from rust or oxidation what is the practical difference to the consumer? None, I suspect.
I believe that newer technologies such as powder coating over an alloyed steel material would make the rust issue a non-factor for all practical purposes.
What I am getting at is don't just jump on plastic as the cure all for manufacturing automobiles. Steel will still be around for a long time IMHO.
How recyclable are the carbon fiber composites?
Just a question as I do not know the answer to that one.
rustproof
by wcoffey81 - 6/22/07 6:43 AM In reply to: rust resistant vs rustproof by deboernkthey are making huge steps in the right direction and some of the products you mention are in use today. the only problem they have a hard time correcting is where two different metal types have to meet/join. some of the galvanic reactions are hard to imagine. remember all of the GM bumpers, in the 80's that fell off. that was from am aluminum bumper reinforcement meeting the steel bumper shock. they even had a thin plastic film in-between to keep them from touching
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