Drop, charge, and lose the cords
Home audio & video: 720 vs 1080p
720 vs 1080p
by HDnewbie - 5/10/07 1:20 PMAm i too understand that all HD tv programs are currently broadcast in 720 only and that 1080 is actualyl years away? If this is so is it even worth the price difference to buy 1080 now?
MR. NEWBEE 1080I is the standard
by stewart norrie - 5/10/07 1:28 PM In reply to: 720 vs 1080p by HDnewbieeverything being broadcast whether satellite, cable or over the air is either 720 or 1080I . most 1080I t.v.s are selling at very low prices so why not get the best stewee
what?
by Operator7 - 5/10/07 1:34 PM In reply to: MR. NEWBEE 1080I is the standard by stewart norriewhat is the difference (if any), between 720 and 1080i?
if there isn't much difference, and 1080i is being sold at lower prices, then why wouldn't you go for those lower prices?
Difference?
by Coryphaeus - 5/10/07 3:13 PM In reply to: what? by Operator7About 360 lines of resolution. On a large screen HD TV the increase in resolution is apparent.
Good question. Get all you can get; be all you can be. But the smaller screens as in below 50" with 1080 resolution are pricey.
My Sony SXRD 55" displays the received resolution with the push of a button on the remote. Everything I see is either 480 or 1080. I've not seen 720.
A lot more than that...
by genotypewriter - 5/11/07 9:36 PM In reply to: Difference? by Coryphaeus720p content has a resolution of 1280x720 = 921,600 pixels
1080p content has a resolution of 1920x1080 = 2,073,600 pixels
In other words, if you take a 720p-native TV and a 1080p-native TV of the same size, the 1080p TV's image is going to be 2.25 times sharper. This is a significant difference especially when dealing with larger screens and very high quality video.
However, 720p content can be delivered up to 60 frames per second but 1080p content can currently do only 30 frames per second. This means that 720p video can be twice as smooth as compared to 1080p's video. However, this rate seems to be quite variable.
Hope this helped!
p vs i
by URTido - 5/11/07 9:27 PM In reply to: what? by Operator7What this discussion lacks is a distinction between 1080p, 1080i, and 720p.
1080p is "Full HD." You may not have a a TV signal that can take full advantage of your resolution, but if you connect your computer or an up converting DVD player to it you can. Wait a bit on Blu-Ray/HD-DVD; there are relatively few titles available for each format, and there doesn't appear to be a clear winner anytime soon. Spend $100 on a up converting player and save the other $500-$900 for when a winner emerges.
While technically a lower resolution 720p still looks better than standard definition. Like 1080p, images boadcast in 720p are refreshed all at the same time, thus the 'p' for progressive.
1080i is misleading because the images are broadcast in an interlaced format. In other words, there are two separate refresh pairs; one set of lines in the image refreshes, and then the other.
To be honest, I can't really see the difference with 1080i, but keep in mind that the physical resolution isn't always representative of what the TV can display. Only 1080p requires the display to be the full 1920x1080 resolution. My plasma TV will show 1080i, but its physical resolution is 1024x768. As a result some of the edges to HD signals are cut off (took me a while to figure out why all the station logos were half off the screen).
Another thing to consider when viewing the TVs in the store is that the picture adjustments make a HUGE difference.
Bottom line:
- If you want HD on a budget get a set with 720p or 1080i, they're not that different.
- If you want to get the most use out of your money and have something to keep up with other technology, spend a little more for a 1080p set.
- Get an up converting DVD player, not a Blu-Ray or HD-DVD player, at least for the time being.
USD299 player, support TrueHD 1080p/1080i movie playback.
by simedarby - 5/12/07 4:33 AM In reply to: p vs i by URTidoThere's the 4th option, a DVD player which can decode TRUE HD 1080p/1080i/720 downloaded HD-DVD or Blu-Ray movie, and support WMV9-HD. It is not upscaling. These type of player can't play HD DVD or Blu-Ray disc, but there are plenty of HDDVD and Blu-Ray movies available to download on the net. The price of player is ~USD299 and above, still cheaper than HDDVD and Blu-ray player. For example, Helios X5000 player is one of those player. Just do a search on HDNet movie which is available in Amazon.
...
by givemeaname - 5/10/07 1:36 PM In reply to: 720 vs 1080p by HDnewbieit going to be many years (10+yrs) until (if) we see 1080p OTA. 1080p is mostly for BluRay (& HDDVD) players + also hooking up your computer.
720p is being fazed out, in 2 years every tv over 40+ will be 1080p.
there is also 1080i & 420p OTA channels besides 720p.
What's the real answer...?
by Hi-def Jeff - 5/11/07 10:13 PM In reply to: 720 vs 1080p by HDnewbieWhy is it a question of money, when the real answer is this:
Unless you will be buying two different TV's to sit side by side for comparison, the vast majority of viewers will never see the difference. (Painful, but true!)
A properly set up 720p HD system will look pretty much indistinguishable from a properly installed 1080i HD system. (The latest step, 1080p, is the smallest change in potential picture quality of all the steps!)
Just be sure to use a reasonably priced HDMI cable so you don't have to fight with the "cut-off" logo's mentioned elsewhere. HDMI's allow two-way communication so you don't have to mess with the formatting.
Hi Def Jeff
www.wowvision.tv
Bad cables?
by URTido - 5/11/07 10:42 PM In reply to: What's the real answer...? by Hi-def JeffI only know of 1 TV from Hitachi that uses true 1080i resolution, all of the others are closer to 720p resolutions.
As others have highlighted, there is a large difference in actual resolution between 1080p and 1080i/720p. This is especially apparent with the a large screen and a source that can display at true 1080p.
The current problem with 1080p is that the bandwidth required is higher than regular HDMI can accommodate at 60 fps, no matter if you have $200 cables or $50 cables. It's much more to do with the available channels (number of lines in 1 cable) than the cables. There's supposed to be a new version of HDMI that is supposed to overcome this problem, but I'm not aware of any current TVs that incorporate it.
HDMI 1.3
by rossmo1 - 5/12/07 7:57 AM In reply to: Bad cables? by URTidoThe new Samsung's have HDMI 1.3. http://reviews.cnet.com/Samsung_LN_T4665F/4505-6482_7-32306311.html?tag=prod.txt.1
Quick format rundown
by k1darkknight - 5/12/07 10:55 AM In reply to: 720 vs 1080p by HDnewbieJust for reference, this is all based on US standards; NTSC for analog broadcast signals, ATSC for digital over-the-air broadcast signals.
Prior to HDTV, all (US) signals were broadcast at a resolution of 720 pixels per line, and 480 lines per frame. Due to the limits of technology at the time, only half the lines were able to be refreshed on each pass. This being the case, odd numbered lines would be refreshed on one pass, evens on the next. This process is called interlacing. In order to maintain compatibility, high definition televisions are capable of displaying signals using this method.
With the introduction of digital television (DTV) and high definition television (HDTV), several new standards have been introduced. Since over-the-air (OTA) stations can broadcast much more content in a narrower frequency range using a digital signal, they actually have a few options. They can either transmit a single signal at maximum HD resolution, or multiple signals at lower resolutions. The latter is commonly referred to as "multicasting".
As far as resolutions go, broadcasters have a total of five standards they can use. Each of these formats has either an "i" or a "p" for a suffix. The "i" suffix denotes an interlaced signal, while the "p" stands for "progressive scan", a term initially used for marketing purposes, as it sounds better than "non-interlaced".
For starters, 480i, commonly called SDTV (standard definition) contains essentially the same image as analog, but in a digital signal. EDTV (enhanced definition) is the name given to the 480p format. This format uses the same resolution as analog and SDTV, but makes for a much smoother image, particularly for sports and scenes containing a lot of rapid motion. These two formats can be broadcast in either the standard (more square-ish) 4:3 aspect ratio (where the picture height is 3/4 its width) or widescreen 16:9 (height is 9/16 width). Any higher resolutions are exclusively 16:9 aspect ratio.
Now, for true HDTV. For one reason or another, the powers that be decided not to make a 720i format, instead skipping right to 720p. This is currently the most common resolution for sports programming, as well as anything explicitly advertised as being "broadcast in HD" (or "in HDTV"). At this point, more detail can be observed, from dirt on the windshield in a NASCAR race, to the sweat dripping down Jack Bauer's face in tense moments on "24".
The two remaining formats, 1080i and 1080p are still fairly uncommon, at least for OTA broadcasts. SOME programming is shown in 1080i, but I'd be surprised if anything has gone 1080p for OTA yet. My own set is only capable of 720p or 1080i, and I haven't really watched anything in the latter format. Everything I've read, though, seems to indicate that a 720p picture is typically superior to that of 1080i, simply because of smoother motion and less flicker with a non-interlaced signal. Obviously, 1080p will trump everything else, but because of the enormous amount of data needed for a 1080p signal, it may be quite some time before such a picture is available by any means other than HD-DVD or Blu-Ray Disc.
To summarize (i=interlaced, p=progressive):
analog: 704 or 720 x 480 (i)
Standard DVDs: 720x480 (i/p)
480i = 704 or 720 x 480, displayed as 640x480 at 4:3
480p = 704x480 (displayed as 640x480) at 4:3, 720x480 (displayed as 854x480) at 16:9
720p = 1280x720
1080i = 1920x1080
1080p = 1920x1080
As for the question of whether 1080p is "worth it", that depends on a few factors. First, and most obvious, is your budget. Second, no TV stations will be broadcasting at 1080p for the foreseeable future, but 1080p IS available from the hi-def disc formats (HD-DVD and Blu-Ray). If you don't have, and won't be buying a player for either (or both) of these formats, or a PS3 or Xbox 360 Elite, you won't be able to take advantage of the extra resolution. Granted, 1080i MIGHT look better on a 1080p display than on a 720p display, but it might not. Finally, if price is an important factor, it comes down to patience. Likely 1080p sets will be more affordable in a few years, but 720p/1080i sets can be found for as little as $500 in a 32" size, already (if you know where to look). All in all, whether it's worth it boils down to what your priorities are. If you won't miss the extra several hundred dollars, go for it! (or save the money and send some my way...hey, worth a shot)
Good luck, and good shopping!
Ooops...forgot to mention
by k1darkknight - 5/12/07 11:10 AM In reply to: Quick format rundown by k1darkknightAlso, plasma televisions tend to use "non-square" pixels.
Often, televisions advertised as 720p will TECHNICALLY have a native resolution that has 768 lines. One of the most common resolutions for computers is 1024x768, using 4:3 aspect ratio. Most plasma TV sets would be prohibitively expensive if they tried to fit a full 1280x720 or 1360x768 resolution, so instead, the manufacturers have reached a compromise. For one reason or another, they have settled on taking a 1024x768 resolution (which is a 4:3 pixel ratio) and stretch it out to fit a 16:9 aspect ratio frame. Using this technique provides a widescreen, high-definition experience, and it DOES take a full 1280x720 signal, scaling it appropriately to fit the screen. However, this results in slightly lower resolution, thus slightly less (potential) picture clarity, than a true 720p LCD or CRT screen. The only advantage of plasma is that manufacturers are able to produce larger screens than with LCD. LCD displays tend to top out around 42" or 47", whereas plasmas are available as large as 50" or even bigger.
All the answers:
by froasier - 5/12/07 6:37 PM In reply to: 720 vs 1080p by HDnewbieAll HDTV is broadcast in 720p or 1080i. "i" is for interlaced, which means odd and even rows of pixels are updated alternately. 1080p TVs can display 1080i content at improved quality (depending on the content and the equipment it can almost match 1080p quality) and they can display 1080p content from sources such as a PC, an Xbox 360 or PS3, an upconverting DVD player, or a Blu-ray or HD-DVD player. So if you mainly just want to watch broadcast TV then you're probably better off getting a 720p/1080i TV for now, but otherwise go for the 1080p if you're getting a big screen.
IMPORTANT NOTE about 1080i: LCD and Plasma TVs can't display interlaced content natively, so they deinterlace it to convert it to their native format. Therefore most HDTVs that say they support 1080i are really 720p TVs that convert the 1080i signal to a 720p output.
Note about frame rates: The current HDTV broadcast standards for NTSC are 720p60 (meaning 60 frames/sec, although some broadcasts may be 720p30 or 720p24) and 1080i60 (meaning 60 fields/sec, equivalent to 24 or 30 frames/sec when deinterlaced). Other formats include 720p24, 720p30, 1080p24, 1080p30, and 1080p60. The p24 formats are used for movies (BD and HD-DVD movies are 1080p24). 1080p60 will eventually be the broadcasting standard. PAL standards include p25, i50, and p50.
Is 1080p worth it?
by arizcale - 5/19/07 10:43 AM In reply to: 720 vs 1080p by HDnewbieBy the time this is posted, many folks have already given a lot of good information, but I have something worthwhile to add. Indeed there is a lot of debate over whether 1080p is worth the premium. There is currently no content available, other than HD-DVD, Blu-Ray, PS3, and X-Box. This will eventually change, though. Over the next several years, 1080p will become more popular, prices will come down, and more content will be available. If you believe that you're going to keep this TV more than a few years, then you ought to CONSIDER a 1080p. There is something else to think about when considering...
To determine the proper resolution, you must also consider (1) the size of the television, and (2) the viewing distance. To make a blanket statement that you need a TV over 60 inches to take advantage of 1080p is misleading. It depends on the combination of viewing distance and TV size. If you sit very close to a 42" TV, it can be more important to have 1080p than with a 60" TV that is 15 feet away. This makes for a slightly more complex analysis, but a handy chart is available on the following blog:
http://ifuhavetoask.blogspot.com/2007/05/size-matters.html
I have found this helpful and many others have agreed. Its not as simple as some rules-of-thumb, but the best decision making help never is. I hope that helps you make a more informed decision.
Thanks,
Cale
HaveToAsk.com
| Forum legend: | |
 |
Locked thread |
 |
Moderator |
 |
CNET staff |
 |
Samsung staff |
 |
Norton Authorized Support team |
 |
AVG staff |
 |
Windows Outreach team |
 |
Dell staff |
 |
Intel staff |
