Community weekly poll: If the U.S. had to choose one cell technology... which one?
- 4/4/07 10:36 AM
CDMA works inside my trailer
by wowweekly - 4/6/07 5:56 PM In reply to: If the U.S. had to choose one cell technology... which one? by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
Verizon works inside my trailer. When I had cingular, I had to place my phone near the window for it to get service. CDMA made it possible for me to drop my landline(what a raper) and just use my verizon lg vx5200 phone.
No brainer - CDMA, on Verizon
by sdnelson33 - 4/8/07 5:44 PM In reply to: If the U.S. had to choose one cell technology... which one? by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
I'm all growed up now ... about five years ago, my brother-in-law was digging into me all the time to 'grow up and get a real cell phone', i.e., Verizon. Which, by the way, has used CDMA since the transition from analog in the late 90's. The other big carrier, AT&T Wireless --> Cingular --> AT&T went on a technically inferior Analog --> TDMA (already outdated by the time it was constructed) path. And I'm glad I did. Verizon continued on their merry way, upgrading their network according to the CDMA revisions, backward and forward compatible, while Cingular transitioned, yet again, to GSM and added yet again another outdated technology, GPRS data, then another stopgap technology, EDGE data, but only in some areas. Meanwhile, Verizon's simply revising most of their network at this point to 3G (1xEvDO Rev.0 data), still backward and forward compatible and in some areas already onto 1xEvDO Rev.A, while Cingular/ATT, YET AGAIN, is rolling to another non-compatible technology. To those that think GSM is the smooth standards path, think again. Because of royalties (to QCOM), CDMA still is more expensive than GSM. But, when you account for the poor voice quality, coverage and capacity issues, that alone, to me, is reason enought to stick with Verizon and their CDMA path. So you really think world standard GSM? Wrong again. Quad-band --> more expensive radio (by the way, you can buy a Verizon world phone that roams abroad, IF YOU REALLY NEED THAT CAPABILITY, but how many do?). I love the fact that I can use my Verizon EvDO card in nearly every urban area nearly anywhere while I watch schmucks trying to connect to various non-interoperable WiFi sites. And Cingular/ATT? Forget about it. Their eqivalent data service (WCDMA/HSPA) has the coverage of my girlfriend's g-string and I challenge you to go buy a device with that capability at a reasonable price. Reasons are apparent for the 3G coverage difference. It's largely about CAPEX. Cingular/ATT made an inferior technology choice and is stuck with anywhere from 4x to 10x the CAPEX as they upgrade their network because the technology choice to WCDMA/HSPA is not backward or forward compatible (total changeover). That's putting it simply. So, yeah, theoretically you'll be able to buy a Cingular/ATT 3G (WCDMA/HSDPA) phone that is backward and forward compatible, but it has to have a GSM radio in it, which drives the cost above the CDMA phones. Try and cover that and the CAPEX differences with the economies of scale of marginally more subscribers -- the numbers don't make sense, the technology choice doesn't make sense, and the user experience throughout the U.S. proves it. The MOST SAVVY wireless consumers in the world, arguably the Koreans ... on CDMA EvDO. Half the Japanese market, CDMA EvDO. You'll see arguments that CDMA is only in a fraction of countries as GSM technology. Think again ... first, either they are EU or heavily aligned with the EU. Or, the country is a cost-sensitive market. And, bottom line, the case here is the age-old "you get what you pay for". Short-term, GSM cheap and easy, perhaps good for a cost-sensitive market. However, a medium-to-long term view invariably comes out on the CDMA side, even putting the quality and capacity issues aside for the moment.
And, by the way, forget about iDEN in this discussion. It, too, is an outdated TDMA derivative, much like GSM, and is seriously outdated and on it's way to transition (probably to CDMA, if NEXTEL's network stays with Sprint).
In summary, not to get too deep into a largely pointless standards debate, it all comes down to the needs of the end user, YOU!!!! Hence (for U.S. consumers):
If you travel domestically much, have conversations where voice quality and coverage are key, have a need for quality data services, and can pay the premium that quality demands, Verizon CDMA is the #1 choice at this time.
If you live in an urban area, travel less extensively, and have Sprint coverage where you live and need quality data services, Sprint is an OK choice (likely #2, IMO).
Wherever you live (assuming Cingular/ATT is offered), if you don't have conversations where voice quality is all that critical and dropouts/coverage aren't as much of an issue, you don't need data services and Cingular/ATT has the plan and phone you prefer, by all means, it suits a basic need. I mean, this is the #1 carrier by # subscribers for a reason -- this is the choice that suits the needs of the masses. And if you find yourself missing something, you're probably missing it for the reasons mentioned in the first two choices.
If international roaming is key for you, it probably depends how much you travel abroad versus your time spent in the U.S., where you live in the U.S., where you travel abroad, and what data services do you need. For all it's worth, I'd probably just buy a prepaid GSM phone or rent a phone if going to EU, unless I absolutely need HS data and a single number. Then, you'd probably find me choosing a Verizon World Phone, not to mention flush with funds and no time to deal with multiple devices and numbers.
By the way, I used to be one of these 'U.S. should just adopt GSM' types -- until I really traveled domestically, really cared about voice quality, depended upon the data services, and learned a bit about the direction of the technology and economics of the industry.
With that, it's your choice. Competing standards and technologies are probably good, to a point.
No brainer - CDMA, on Verizon
by ridy163 - 4/9/07 7:48 PM In reply to: No brainer - CDMA, on Verizon by sdnelson33to sdnelson33
you have very limited and poor knowlege of the industry and it's standards, next time you post something - do your homework!!!!>>>
try to back up the "facts" you provide, let me know what happens...
Prove it.
by sdnelson33 - 4/10/07 12:25 AM In reply to: No brainer - CDMA, on Verizon by ridy163I'll go toe-to-toe with you any time on this. Don't just throw out criticism without backing up your position.
PROVE
by ridy163 - 4/10/07 10:41 AM In reply to: Prove it. by sdnelson33You say TDMA is a analog, not true...
you talk about forward compatability, there is no such a thing..
whats wrong with GPRS or EDGE?
Verizon world phone is a GSM phone.
you say UMTS is an incompatible technology, may be UMTS is CDMA ????????
DO YOU HAVE A CLUE?
Peace, Friends...
by euspos - 4/10/07 11:33 AM In reply to: PROVE by ridy163This resembles all too much of the mud slinging in the industry in the mid-90ies here in North America. Please don't take us back to those days.
I am a VERY strong GSM proponent, but CDMA has its role as well. It is always good with competing technologies to push the technical evolution.
As "deployed" by the carriers (VZ and Sprint/Nextel) CDMA is a bit more "controlling" due to the fact how handsets are handled in the market. But, t-mobile and Cingular/AT&T are not much better either in their quest to tightly control what hands sets that get on their network.
But all of this is really not so much technical issues as they are commercial ones. And it "passes" because the average American consumer does not demand more from their carriers.
Working for a large telecom manufacturer, I've sold network deployments including both technologies. My heart is with GSM, but a carrier that wants to deploy CDMA has good reasons for it. I respect them.
hello
by sdnelson33 - 4/12/07 2:51 AM In reply to: PROVE by ridy163I agree with poster below about not wanting to get into the age old flame wars on this topic, but to set the record absolutely straight:
1. Never said TDMA was analog. Where did you read that? Absolutely not. GSM is a TDMA-based technology. iDEN is a TDMA-based technology. They are all highly-related and OUTDATED. Just look at the spectral efficiency comparison between the technologies. There is a reason GSM will eventually get pushed out of the network with the evolution to HSPA/WCDMA/UMTS and even beyond, e.g., LTE.
And to answer your questions about having a "CLUE": I worked for years for the company that did pioneer the GSM system, as well as made the very first call on the first true handy, going on to then commercialize it. Beyond that, my entire career have worked pioneering mobile data applications on every major network technology in the world from CSD on AMPS to data transmission on GSM from even within the Black Forest, on to today's EvDO, GPRS, EDGE, etc. Case in point: at a time very few were doing modem transmissions on AMPS, pioneering the methodology to keep the data transmission going and modem sync during typical freeway handoffs at 60mph.
2. Sure there is forward compatibility. Just because it isn't in your vernacular doesn't mean it isn't a term that is used in the industry. Many people commonly say 'backward compatible'. That might typically be with respect to the network. But from the device perspective, some say 'forward compatible' to refer to the fact that a device will continue to operate into the future on evolving networks.
3. GPRS = 56k at best. Okay for some mundane tasks. As far as technology goes, it's old hat. EDGE (~125 kbps typical, theoretical is higher but you'll never see that) is really a 2G technology, 2.5G in the best of light. Why would I bother for an EDGE device when my CDMA RAZR and my Kyocera CDMA card are both true 3G (EvDO Rev.0). With the data card, I commonly see speeds of ~300k all over the country and do see peaks of ~700k when it's needed (unlike small pockets of HSPA coverage on Cingular/ATT, not even available on T-Mobile). Within the next three months, I'll upgrade my Rev.0 card to a Rev.A and see screaming speeds (what will quickly become MORE coverage areas than you will find HSPA on Cingular) on the upgraded parts of the network with backfall to Rev.0 in other areas where Verizon has not yet rolled Rev.A.
4. No, Verizon world phones are multimode CDMA/GSM devices, probably soon to be CDMA/GSM-UMTS.
5. UMTS is not CDMA (as in IS-95 or IS-2000). It is, however, WCDMA, which is a whole different ballgame. You will probably see GSM supported on the U.S. networks well into the 2010 decade. It'll be interesting to see the trend when the EU GSM licenses expire in 2016. My bet is that GSM in the U.S., at least, will taper off much like analog has leading up to the sunset (just try to get an AMPS channel in some areas even today before the official sunset -- not gonna happen). There are rumors from within the carriers that already GPRS channels are being slowly & silently pulled to make way for WCDMA/HSPA.
hello
by ridy163 - 4/12/07 8:06 AM In reply to: hello by sdnelson331.this is what you wrote: "The other big carrier, AT&T Wireless --> Cingular --> AT&T went on a technically inferior Analog --> TDMA (already outdated by the time it was constructed) path".
2. not on the hardware level
3.you are comparing 2.5G against 3g. EDGE Class 32, 296 / 177.6 kbits. T mobile is rolling out HSDPA this year. UMTS/HSDPA is for voice and data, EV-DO data only.
4. verizon phones use GSM roaming
5.UMTS is is a derivative of cdma
regardless if it is GSM or CDMA, non of these technologies are standing still, they all are moving forward. GSM is not going to die, it will evolve in to 3GSM, then 4GSM.
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