Windows Vista: Windows Vista Bugs
One more thing
by meisinscotland - 3/16/07 11:14 AM In reply to: Vista ? Why? by blue51557A call centre called TSC near where I used to live is still on Windows 2000 
Microsoft and Vendors need a better system
by Techs In A Sec - 3/15/07 8:43 AM In reply to: Windows Vista Bugs by photohamI blame both parties. Microsoft knows that some software and devices will not work correctly on Vista. Vendors also know there will be conflicts and their support calls will soar. Do they all want to charge and make an extra buck on support and new sales? Possibly. They are doing a great job if thats their goal. However if they want a smooth transition they need to communicate more between each other. They couldnt possibly have done enough based on the amount of problems Vista is causing. I own a Tech company and see the amount of problems clients are having. Many are formatting and going back to XP. Avoid Vista until the bugs are worked out. Never install anew OS until its been on the market for at least 6months.
No one is forcing you to move to Vista
by KitCarson - 3/15/07 9:39 AM In reply to: Microsoft and Vendors need a better system by Techs In A SecSo, you have a machine with XP on it, but you want a new machine and are concerned you can't get one with XP. I just spoke to Dell and was told you can get two of their machines with XP. The rest can all support XP.
You don't want to purchase XP for your new machine? Use the licensed copy of XP from your old machine! If you want to keep both machines and stay compliant with your licenses of XP, BUY it! It's cheap.
This car comparison is absurd. If you upgrade from a VW Beatle to a Suburban, should you be able to keep your old out of date engine and use it in your new vehicle? - Childishness.
Here is what I find most amusing: WE HAD THESE SAME DICUSSIONS when moving from WinX/NT to XP!!! Now, XP is the superior operating system??!! The vendors STILL dragged their arses then, but eventually either came out with new drivers, or flat out refused to. I do not do business with the later type, unless the product in question is FIVE years old!
Give it some time or find another solution instead of spending time and energy whining and complaining about technological progress...
And for it's worth, I work for an origination that has the MS Solutions Provider status. We've had Vista for well over a year. It was just code-named something else. WE ran all our developed applications through the platform testing tools THAT MICROSOFT PROVIDED. If we had a problem we couldn't figure out, THEY HELPED US RESOLVE THEM.
Yes, Microsoft delivers applications with bugs in them. It's always best to wait until SP2 is available BEFORE putting something new into production. Here, our standard is to wait for a product to be "on the streets" for one year. We've had no problems using this method.
Also, we get in HP desktops and servers at a rate of at least 10 per day. We only order duel core or duel processor/duel core desktops and ALL come with XP already installed. That's how we order them...
How about the responsibilities of the user?
by aragorn851 - 3/15/07 8:44 AM In reply to: Windows Vista Bugs by photohamMS's upgrade to Vista is a bit like the upgrade to the HD DVD format--sure, it's an improvement, but it's also a way to "force" consumers to spend more money refreshing/upgrading their entire system. Windows is MS's cash cow.
But by the same token if someone chooses to be an early adopter of new technology, they need to recognize that this means they will be subject to all of the bugs and incompatibilities that have not yet been worked out by real-world use. The tradeoff of rushing to be the first on the block to get the new equipment means you'll be paying a higher price for the privilege--not just in money, but in terms of system problems.
While I understand the disappointment people felt when they found Vista was incompatible with certain hardware and software first, they should have done the research first to check compatibility or to get the appropriate drivers ahead of time.
To Blame?
by WAArnold - 3/15/07 8:47 AM In reply to: Windows Vista Bugs by photohamObviously it is us, the user, that is to blame.
Why do we keep purchasing such ill written programs? That puts gold in their pockets and our of ours.
Quit buying every os that comes out and force microsoft to correct what they have already published. If we continually flood them with purchase of faulty product, guess what, they will continue giving us faulty product.
All I saw out of Vista was, and this I told Microsft also, a real nice graphic package. Yes, it has nice graphics. Yes, it has eye appeal. Yes, it takes up lots of real estate, lots of memory to run, hard disk to store. BUT, what does it do better for me? Does it run my programs better than, say, 2000? No. Does it support my hardware better than, say, ME? No. So why should I purchase vista that I know will pretty well require me to lay out hundreds of bucks just to do the same job as I am already doing. Like writing this message. Or writing a letter with Microsoft Word. Or browsing the net?
No folks, vista as pointed out is a microsoft responsibility. They should have given the software venders ample time to make adjustments to programming if the specs had changed.
What I see out of the whole thing is nothing but ONE BIG MONEY GENERATING machine. Produced for one purpose, income into the vender and Microsoft's deep pockets.
DON'T PURCHASE THE NEW PRODUCT UNTIL IT'S PROVEN GOOD AND STABLE.
Upgrading to Vista?
by Ca$h - 3/15/07 8:47 AM In reply to: Windows Vista Bugs by photohamHave you ever heard the expression: "if it ain't broke.........."? If all of your software/hardware is working relatively well now, why are you upgrading? As to who's at fault, it's you, naturally! If you upgraded from a Volkswagen to a Chevy would you expect that the wheels on your old car would fit on the new one. If your old car is running OK, why buy a new one. I have a lot of software which probably won't work on Vista, so I wouldn't want to take a chance on it. I also have a couple of HP printers, which I've already heard are not compatable with Vista. And the the topper is: WM 2003 SE (Dell Axim x50v) isn't supported by Vista!
I'm one of those old codgers that used to use (and am still using) Win 3.x(DOS), as well as 95,98,ME, and XP (note: I'm using all of them NOW). At our monthly confuser club meeting, last night, we were given a demo of Vista Ultimate; as well as a discussion of why we would or would not upgrade. The guy demonstrating it said he, as a rule, doesn't upgrade until at least SP2 (read: [S]oftware [P]atch 2) of any software release.
I'm still trying to figure out what an administrator is and what an owner is (having bought a new desktop with XP home and a new laptop with XP professional). OH, did I not mention that I have 14 confusers of varying vintages (all still operational)?
I recently downloaded and installed IE7, but it's giving me a lot of problems, so I'm going back to IE6, as soon as I figure out how. And I hate Outlook with a passion (mostly because of the grossly inadequite address book) and am going back to PocoMail (for U3), which I was using 20 years ago.
If it ain't broke
by artsr3 - 3/15/07 9:38 AM In reply to: Upgrading to Vista? by Ca$hWith this attidute, we would all be driving around in Modle T Ford's. Progress marches on. Get used to it or get left behind.
Shared resposability
by Sacul2 - 3/15/07 8:56 AM In reply to: Windows Vista Bugs by photohamI use both Mac and Pcīs. Mac went thru a similar problem when it changed to intel chips. But apple had the good sense to incorporate rosseta in the Os so that non intel programs would work, eventhough at a slighty lower performance.
Microsoft and the new Vista Os arenīt really responsible for all the incompatabilities with third party software. But It most defenitly is Microsofts resposability, to make absolutly sure that itīs new Os is comatible with the diferent hardwares that are there. This means drivers.
True... there are limits to how much you can make something backwards compatible, but the big problem here is that vista isnīt really compatible with anything but vista ready machines.
I blame MS & HP. Bought new HP comp. w/Vista
by beautifulbooks - 3/15/07 8:57 AM In reply to: Windows Vista Bugs by photohamHello,
I didn't upgrade, about 1 month ago I bought a new HP a1730n which had VISTA loaded as the OS. For the past two weeks I have had horrible problems with sudden error messages (too many different to even track), unexpected shut downs, corrupted files in Norton (why?) which eventually kept the machine from even starting up fully without Restores. I had to do hard restarts twice just to get it to fire up this morning. Blue screens, mini-dumps -- It was suggested that I "insert my Vista disc" but I don't even have one 
I have had to restore 3x back to 3/2 settings (prior to 3 or 4 Microsoft automatic updates after that date?). I handled the idea that some of my main software wouldn't work but I DID expect the new computer to at least turn on, stay on and work reliably. I blame Microsoft and HP.
Kristin
I agree with photoham about Vista . . . with reservations
by samjemb - 3/15/07 8:57 AM In reply to: Windows Vista Bugs by photohamI, too, upgraded one of my PC's to Vista in hopeful anticipation of a great new, modern operating system, only to also be plagued by explorer crashes, run32dll errors, and other frustrating issues.
No doubt many of these are due to third party drivers that are not truly vista compatible yet, and there is certainly blame on the part of manufacturers for this. But Microsoft must also assume some of the blame.
Maybe Microsoft should have worked closer (and longer) with major PC hardware and software vendors before releasing Vista. Maybe Microsoft should have requested Vista drivers from major PC hardware and software vendors and put them to the test before releasing Vista. I hesitate to condemn Microsoft, because I am not on the inside and I don't know what's involved in releasing a major operating system upgrade. But what I do know is that upgrading to Vista should be a reasonably seamless process, and for me it has been anything but seamless.
I, for one, will not be moving over to the MAC world. Not because I don't think MACS are great computers; they definitely are. I will stick with the PC world because I have a great deal of time, money and knowledge invested in that world. And I will stick with Vista in the hope that Microsoft and third party hardware and software vendors will, in time, sort out this mess and get things running smoothly again.
MS Only Partly to Blame
by mtnman - 3/15/07 9:06 AM In reply to: Windows Vista Bugs by photohamWhile most hardware venders are scrambling to update their drivers to support Vista, some software venders are using Vista's release to drive revenue by intentionally not patching existing versions of their software and requiring users to upgrade. A good example of this is Intuit, maker of Quicken and Quickbooks. Intuit is refusing to patch versions other than 2007 of their software and began sending upgrade notices to it's customers a couple weeks before Vista's release telling Quickbooks 2006 and earlier users that they would need to shell out $180+ if they wished to use their products with Vista. Adobe is taking the same approach with their high dollar suites like Macromedia and PhotoShop stating that new versions that fully support Vista will be available this summer but that they do not intend to patch existing versions. So I wouldn't come down too hard on Microsoft about Vista's software issues, new operating systems are a major profit event for some software makers and we are left to either pay the price or find different software.
Microsoft is to blame
by ejmc76 - 3/15/07 9:06 AM In reply to: Windows Vista Bugs by photohamWindows Vista is still Windows, and as such should be compatible with products made to work with XP. Surely since it is THEIR system, Microsoft should have no problem ensuring that it is backwards-compatible. Aside from the incompatibility with third-party products, Vista has bugs galore, which is the reason that after buying TWO Vista OS HP laptops over the past month, and returning both I have switched (probably permanently) to an imac.
I Totally Agree With You
by SqueakeyCat - 3/15/07 9:09 AM In reply to: Windows Vista Bugs by photohamMy father just received his new computer Friday, the 9th of March. I have gone through PC Repair Courses, and, in every course I have taken I have not found ONE OF THEM to even include the VISTA program with the course outline or materials.
He bought a Dell Dimensions E 520. It has Vista Home Basic on it. We tried to install his DELL PHOTO ALL IN ONE 962 Printer/Fax/Scanner onto the computer.
All it did was the first disk (only asking for the SCANNER information). Also, when we rebooted the computer, and tried to FIND the printer, it could NOT be found anywhere.
We even looked for the ADD/REMOVE programs box that normally comes with the CONTROL PANEL. What we found, even in CLASSIC mode, was absolutely NO ADD/REMOVE icon or anything even remotely looking like that icon.
Also, after talking to a DELL TECH online for more than 2 1/2 hours, they still could NOT tell me where to find the printer at, or how to uninstall it to be able to reinstall it properly.
Another thing to keep in mind, is that the VISTA does NOT come with a manual on HOW TO USE IT. This part, should not be put to blame on DELL, but on Microsoft itself, as MICROSOFT is the one that made the program to begin with, NOT DELL, HP, or ne other company that puts the VISTA program on their computers.
Yet, another thing to keep in mind, is that a lot of these companies are NOT supplying RE-INSTALL disks, but, they r taking up, on an average, of 25% of ur hard drive, to make "a picture" copy of your system ON YOUR HARD DRIVE, in case of having to reformat the hard drive.
The 3rd party company, no matter who it is, is telling you that you r getting an 80 gb hd (example), of that 80 gbs, 25% or more of it, is JUST ANOTHER COPY OF YOUR OPERATING SYSTEM. If a company is going to advertise 40, 80, 120, 160, 200, 250, 300, 500 GB, or even 1TB of hard drive space, then give the customer that space, and ADD the extra space for their so called PICTURE COPY of the system, NOT take away from the usable space we are asking for.
I bought my Dell, in July 2006. On the front of the computer, in plain site of anyone that looks at it, it says VISTA CAPABLE on it, yet, when I tried to upgrade to VISTA, I was given information that states that MY COMPUTER (though it STATES CLEARLY THAT IT IS VISTA CAPABLE), is NOT VISTA CAPABLE at all.
To show you what I mean about the above, here is the link to the page that was displayed to me, concerning my VISTA CAPABLE COMPUTER:
http://www.geocities.com/mew_mewto/VistaAssessmentResults.htm
and I hope that this link works, especialy for those that have a DELL computer, that states that it is VISTA CAPABLE on it.
Between DELL & MICROSOFT, I too am fed up with their BS. AND FOR GODS SAKE DON'T DO REMOTE ASSISTANCE WITH ANY DELL TECH. The one tech that I allowed to do remote assistance, wound up SCREWING UP a 2 week old computer, AND, DELL has done absolutely NOTHING to help fix it, or even send a tech OUT TO MY HOUSE to see where the problem is coming from. So, needless to say, almost 8 months later, I STILL HAVE THE SAME ISSUES as I had back in AUGUST OF 2006 when this computer was only 2 weeks old.
And as for the diehard "Microsoft can do no wrong" people, OPEN YOUR DAMN EYES AND SEE REALITY. Not once, since I have been using Microsoft Windows OS Programs, have I ever found one single computer that has NOT had errors of some sort that come up about drivers, ports, usb connections, etc., and that is NOT just due to using Dell products either, as I also have a COMPAQ WINDOWS XP OS & an IBM WINDOWS 98 OS, and BOTH of them also have problems with the same things that the new so-called BEST OS "VISTA" has.
So, in my opinion, NO it is NOT the 3rd parties fault about the drivers, but Microsofts. When I have 3 different types of computers, all with Windows OS on them, and all with driver issues, ports issues, usb connection issues, this does NOT become the third party's problem, this becomes a MICROSOFT problem.
And, just so everyone knows, I don't give a rats arse if anyone agrees with me or not, but I DO AGREE WITH PHOTOHAM.
Also, just so that you know, where it is saying that I DO NOT HAVE the items listed, I can readily prove to you that I do actually have what they are telling me I do NOT have.
And, if that page isn't enough proof for you about the VISTA OS program, then I will list specifically, every detail of my computer that it is telling me DOES NOT EXIST on my computer.
SqueakeyCat
microsoft is not responsible for anything past their product
by der_teufel - 3/15/07 9:14 AM In reply to: Windows Vista Bugs by photohamI'm not a mircosoft fan by any means. But you don't hold the car company liable if your aftermarket wheels don't work on your new car. Each of the 3rd party vendors are responsible for making their product work with a new OS (MS, Mac, Linux, whatever). Personally I never migrate my primary PC to a new OS until the early users help get the bugs worked out, however I do install the beta versions on my 64bit Sager laptop. I have found that most beta versions of MS OS's work better than the first release products until SP1's come out. The only hard part is modifying XP 64bit drivers to work on the vista side. It does work if you are willing to tweak a driver yourself. I'm not a programmer either, but I will search the internet for my issue until I find a solution and follow it step by step until I get my PC running. I have always had to do my own OS tweaks because most programs were never multi-threaded and I have always had my primary PC be a multi-processor (currently a p4 quad Xeon 2.66)
1. Spend the time to learn to fix most of your OS through creative solutions. Most of the time you will find details of someone else who has already fixed your issue. You will be more prepared for the next incompatibility.
2. Don't buy more products from companies that do not deliver new drivers on time or at all. For this reason alone I quit buying from "Creative" as they put all their efforts into new products and immediately quit making new software/drivers for all other models.
3. Learn how to slip stream your drivers. this resolves a whole host of install issues. also if you are having conflicts after install, swap the slots on all of the cards you have on the MB (if you can).
Just like NT
by anapro - 3/15/07 9:21 AM In reply to: Windows Vista Bugs by photohamI was an early adopter of NT when it came out in 1993. At that time, there was the same problem with the lack of software support. When customer demand ramps up, the vendors will respond.
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