Windows Vista: Windows Vista Bugs
You may have a point...
by beebarnes777 - 3/15/07 9:00 AM In reply to: Here we go again by IconoclysmYou may have a point... and it seems at least from their cute commercials that Mac's have at least taken the non-technical audience into their fold. Me, I'm not a techy person. I can install and uninstall, even clean my registry or defrag my hard drive. but all this driver and hardware exchange to get my computer to do what it already has been doing is a bear and to my way of thinking, not worth the trouble. The fact is that I know there are millions out there that think like me.
With Mac, you'll just be dealing with worse crap
by Igiveup2 - 3/14/07 11:56 PM In reply to: I'm right behind you Larry, hello Mac/Leopard by rniceI have no regrets bailing from Mac into Vista. The move was driven by Mac's poor hardware quality and service. Just not worth the extra expense. There's no way Mac would survive as a hardware manufacturer if they didn't have a monopoly on the OS. If you feel your choices are limited under Windows, you'll find them WAY more limited under Mac. Kind of funny that one of Mac's selling points is that you can run........Windows!
Amen, Apple Sucks
by BradKC1 - 3/16/07 11:42 AM In reply to: With Mac, you'll just be dealing with worse crap by Igiveup2Anyone who thinks Apple has their act together and that their OS is bullet proof, their hardware reliable, and you're going to be in heaven is going to be sorely disappointed. Mac's are EXPENSIVE to begin with, software is limited, and fixing or replacing failed hardware a nightmare. In addition, if you want to build your own machine Apple is not your place.
The marketplace has already shoved Apple to the back of the bus where they belong. Most stores won't even sell Apple equipment and the one's that do have extremely small sections devoted to Apple.
Apple is a competitor to no one and not to be taken seriously.
Same feelings...
by BCrampon - 3/15/07 4:15 AM In reply to: I'm right behind you Larry, hello Mac/Leopard by rniceMy next move is going to be buying an Apple laptop, install for a while W XP on it to insure a safe and smooth transition (I've got too many only W applications). I've been using MS since DOS 3.x.
I've be fighting too long hoping things will change. I was also hoping for a good and simple Linux desktop to migrate to.
Bernard
Touché!
by indybuilder - 3/15/07 5:15 AM In reply to: I'm right behind you Larry, hello Mac/Leopard by rniceWell said!
Vista not compatible
by MKorkowski - 3/15/07 6:45 AM In reply to: I'm right behind you Larry, hello Mac/Leopard by rniceI also am an Electrical Engneer/IT person. I could never go to a MAC...but the simple fact is Vista is not WOW. I just bought (2) Dell laptops for my daughters and spent hours last Sunday getting them set up. Vista really has a long way to go. I am not impressed to say the least! Talk about memory hog. Unbelieveable! Its all about the drivers. Especially the chipsets. Right now there are few systems that have good chipset drivers. What they have is a driver that will work and that is it. The Dell case that I was working on is a small example. No system that is running at good performance should ever see "Standard IDE controller" in control panel. You need a hardware driver from your vendor. Microsoft does not allow drivers that are unsigned in Vista. This makes more work for vendors and then the Microsoft acceptance red tape adds to it all. Your peformance is NOTHING without a good vendor driver. The standard controller driver is a stripped down Microsoft product that works...at a snails pace. There is NO WAY I am moving to Vista until I see good drivers IN USE.
faulty analysis
by jayatcnet375 - 3/15/07 8:01 AM In reply to: I'm right behind you Larry, hello Mac/Leopard by rniceA: If you think MS has frequent OS changes, wait until you spend a little time with Apple. Version incompatibility is worse with Apple, and Apple charges for every version upgrade. Apple's ways of handling files is bizarre compared with MS. I inherited an Apple, attended Apple user group meetings, bought and read so-called transition manuals aimed at former MS users, and finally dumped the Apple as an expensive waste of time. Good luck.
B: MS gives a lot of help, and time to adapt, to applications developers. If those developers don't pay attention and do their upgrades on time (e.g., during the beta testing or earlier), then users should abandon those laggards and move to programs which will keep up.
Hmmmm.....Interesting
by amab11 - 2/16/07 7:28 AM In reply to: This scene sounds like Microsoft to a T by Larry Launstein JrOh yea, no other company forces you to upgrade to a new operating system all the time....oh wait, isn't that what Apple does? Might I remind you all that XP has been out for 5 years [while all of those nice and shiny Apple upgrades have been out for less] and has stood the test of time. Microsoft has to deal with 90-95% of the world's user problems, 100% of its viruses [Apple gets ignored because they are such a small percentage of the users, not because it's 'more secure'], and countless third-party vendors for both the hardware and software issues. I'd say that they've done a good job. Yea Mac doesn't have as many user problems but you also don't have many options when you're shopping for a new Mac, that's because they control both the hardware/software [which isn't always a good thing], nor do you have as many software options to choose from [third-party wise]. Both computers are good and bad, and so are both companies [Mac users seem to be ignoring that whole illegal stock-dating issue by their beloved CEO]. Get over yourselves.
FOLLOW THE MONEY
by rlegro - 2/16/07 8:04 AM In reply to: Hmmmm.....Interesting by amab11This chaos is only half unintentional. It makes money for everyone, Microsoft included. It isn't accidental that one of the few XP-class productivity programs that works flawlessly on my flawed new Vista laptop is OpenOffice Org. Why would that be? My guess: OpenOffice is free. It's user supported, and it's get upgraded quickly, without all sorts of tweaks and strange code that come from a small, pressurized group of microserfs working in a private software house. Roxio, Nero, Scansoft -- the list goes on -- all are offering Vista upgrades (quality to be determined) and all want you to pay around a C-note apiece for the privilege of getting back what you already had.
I think I'll be dumping Vista and installing Win2000 Pro on this new box. And/or adding a boot manager so I can also run SuSE Linux 10, as I already do on my other box.
Apple? Yeah, it charges for more frequent OS upgrades, but you'll note that the money actually is a wise investment, since the system isn't immediately broken the moment you do the upgrade. Some people can't even succeed in upgrading to Vista, but if like me you buy a new PC already fitted with the OS, you're not much better off. I've already got third party apps on this machine that won't work right under Vista and -- worse -- refuse to be uninstalled. Blame whomever you like, but don't blame Apple or the Linux community. Bill Gates, like George W. Bush, lives in an alternate reality where he has and can afford all the fixers he needs. The rest of us will go broke staying in his fold. But, wow, isn't Aero pretty? Only if you can afford the computing hardware to run it at more than a snail's pace. In modern bizmo-America, appearances are everything, while substance is to be ignored.
Only what I think...
by lhsonic - 3/14/07 9:10 PM In reply to: Hmmmm.....Interesting by amab11Apple is not considered a software company, they are into hardware and the Mac OS is just a supplement (a good one at that) to run the system, like the interface on a good mp3 player. The interface is not the key in a mp3 designer's head, but having a good one sells (iPods). If you ask me, my unbiased answer would be that Vista has very similar elements to a Mac, regardless of who "copied" the other. Sidebar vs widgets. 3D application switching vs Expose. Big folders vs ...big folders (mac had them first though). As for why people buy Vista or Mac: Macs are HUGE in the creative design business, you see them everywhere creative designers are... and I wouldn't say that, aside from games and user-made apps, there's many programs that are Windows only. Well, at least not for the designers who depend on systems to run Final Cut Pro (Mac only for a change), Flash, Dreamweaver, Illustrator, Photoshop, etc.
On who's at fault for drivers, Vista was on Beta for the LONGEST time, and so was the public beta. There is no way that a 3rd party didn't have the time to properly design and test new drivers. However, the amount of system power to run a game at the same level it did on XP is ridiculous. Personally, I ran Vista for a while, and decided to stick with XP for now until Vista truly does become mainstream (and it will in about a year) and I have gotten computer upgrades (if I still have enough money from getting a Macbook). I liked the interface... and for me, speeds for Windows was very good, however, driver and application incompatibility and lagging in games that didn't lag on XP keeps me from a permanent switch. That's the best of both world ladies and gents. A Windows desktop at home and a macbook for school.
Apple gets malware, too.
by jayatcnet375 - 3/15/07 8:15 AM In reply to: Hmmmm.....Interesting by amab11For those who think they will avoid viruses and similar problems by going to Apple, truck on over to Brian Krebs's column Security Fix in the Washington Post's web page, and search down into his prior blogs on Apple. Apple ignores known bugs and malicious programs for longer than Microsoft, does. Some Apple user groups include serious denyers among their senior members, which leaves Apple newbies without needed help.
No matter how you slice & dice it...
by b8375629 - 2/16/07 10:42 AM In reply to: This scene sounds like Microsoft to a T by Larry Launstein JrAs a longtime Windows user, the fact is both Apple & Linux benefit from this latest fiasco by Bill Gates & Co. It may be a small benefit or it may be a large one. But it certainly won't be a negative either way for either one of those two OS's. I know of at least three people in the last two weeks looking for new computers and all three bought Apples. They figured that if they were gonna have to learn some thing new, then they were at least gonna get something reasonably reliable.
I saw one lady go into my nearest Office Depot mad as hell at her Vista HP laptop and all the driver BS she had to go through. Couldn't get her software to update, couldn't get her printer attached, couldn't plug in an external USB drive and write to it, couldn’t get her camera to work… the list goes on and on and on...
And this was an HP laptop with a pre-installed version of Vista on it! Never mind the folks doing the XP to Vista upgrades nightmare. She wanted her money back, which the store promptly refunded.
Don’t get me wrong. All three OSs have their share of problems, but who stands to gain? Think about it.
Steve Jobs et al. must be laughing.
whose fault is it anyway???
by holedout - 3/14/07 5:52 PM In reply to: This scene sounds like Microsoft to a T by Larry Launstein JrI didn't realize there were so many people out there being forced to change over to a new, i.e. Vista, operating system. Sounds like bad old Microsoft been doin' lots of folks wrong! I bought a new, Vista ready computer in early December, have received my upgrade of Vista Home Premium, and it sits on a shelf, where it will remain until I have done my due diligence...yeah, that's right, my part...There are several links available to test your current configuration, to see, so that you will have a good idea going in what problems to expect. A good example, Dell set up a Raid 1 with Norton Ghost on my new computer, and Ghost isn't Vista ready according to MS. Boo Hoo! It's a new OS, and of course it will have kinks. The first year is merely the extended public Beta. If you want to be on the forefront, expect to be occasionally burned, but at least open your eyes, read and investigate before you install, download and whine.
For those complaining about VISTA
by jamesrasmussen - 3/14/07 9:20 PM In reply to: This scene sounds like Microsoft to a T by Larry Launstein JrA lot of people are complaining about VISTA incompatabilities and are blaming Microsoft.
What they forget about is that VISTA was in Beta for over two years. The hardware and software third party venders all have had plenty of time to make their products VISTA Compatable.
Most hardware vendors do not care about what Operating Systems work with their hardware once they stop manufacturing that product. This costs them money with no return to them. They would prefer that you buy a new product from them.
The same applies to Software Vendors. That is a major reason for new versions of Vendor Software.
Remember that these third party vendors are all out to make money not to spend it on upgrades to products already sold.
For those that contemplate a move to a MAC. Just remeber that the last three major software operating systems from Apple for the MAC platforms required that you buy all new hardware and software to use the new OS.
Apple Upgrades
by donalpixny - 3/15/07 8:41 AM In reply to: For those complaining about VISTA by jamesrasmussenNot so. I have had an Apple desktop machine, built in 2001, which has NOT, REPEAT N*O*T, required any hardware upgrades to run each new iteration of the OS; there has been backward compatibility. Yes, the current models will not run software from 1990's (OS9), but few users lust for that 200Mhz performance buzz these days, anyway. But, if I want to run Photoshop 4 for some reason, I can.
Apple had many problems with the first release of OSX, which like Vista, was a public beta, but they learned from their experience, and the change to the Intel processors 2 years ago was very smooth, with full backward compatibility for the older machines.
True, software and 3rd party hardware makers dislike having to write new code for old product, simply to keep them working with a new OS, but it is a process that the OS can manage well or not.
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