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Windows Vista: Windows Vista Bugs
Compatability
by raptor3d - 3/15/07 7:46 AM In reply to: Customer Service Issues by dgranthamThere are large software developers who can easily afford to form up a team of $65K a year software engineers to recode their drivers etc. and there are those who cannot afford to drop all thier development effort and focus on porting their software for Microsoft's development project(benefit).
There was a time when I was working a IBM that when the OS made a major step forward, we went so far as develop emulation engines to transvert old calls to new ones. And we did extensive compatibility testing. This was for vendor loyalty. When we found issues we called the vendor and helped them fix it.
I'm sure MS tried to break the fewest things possible and I'm also sure that the vendors, if they can afford it, would love to have their software run on Vista. However MS does appear to be a bit arrogant in this regard.
My own solution is to wait for it to all filter out. Other than a brand new piece of hardware, what's the rush for Vista? Going to a Mac's not the answer the software you want probably doesn't exist on that 2% of the market and if it does you'll have to repurchase your inventory of software and retrain your staff.
Deja vu
Business may sink Vista
by glloydd95 - 3/15/07 7:54 AM In reply to: Customer Service Issues by dgranthamI am an IT director for a Tier 1 part supplier to a major automotive manufacturer.
As such, I oversee a large, enterprise level Windows network.
One thing that Microsoft and Intel have always done is make things relatively compatible with existing hardware and software. They do this because they to keep doing business with companies like mine.
There is no way a company is going to purchase new machines or a new OS if it means scrapping an ERP solution or a financial tracking package they just paid $200,000 for 2 years ago.
Business, especially the manufacturing sector, doesn't move like that.
We move much slower with equipment and software we know we can depend on. Typically, our part sequencing house operates 5 hours ahead of the GM plant across the street. If the right PC were to crash or it's hot spare were to crash, it could potentially bring the corresponding GM assembly line to a halt, thereby costing my company thousands of dollars per minute of downtime. (and my job most likely)
My network at last audit was composed of 1270 workstations, 42 servers, and over 100 different kinds of printers, plotters, scanners, cameras, etc. We routinely retire and cycle out 200 workstations a year. My company is small compared to some and there are over 1500 Tier 1 suppliers in the auto industry alone.
And none of them will be using Vista in any way for at least 5 years...possibly never...because of compatibility and networking issues. I talk regularly with other people in my position in other companies and no one likes or plans to use Vista.
And it isn't the same as when XP came out. I liked XP over 2KPro for a variety of reasons and began converting about 6 months after it came out. Vista may get their drivers in order but there will always be too many current applications that will never run properly on Vista and so it becomes useless.
The home user may drive R&D but it is business that drives sales and profits. I spend more in one week on equipment than most home users spend in 10 years. The last time I remember this big of an egg being laid was ME...and that is where I believe Vista will end up.
Most companies have volume licensed XP at their disposal so we will either buy new units without an OS, reload new units with XP, or build from barebones and load XP.
In any event, some of you may be happy there is an OS which will use your newer equipment properly but the home-use/gaming market does not generate enough sales to support Vista and keep it viable...business does. Before you could count on enough backward compatibility to consider change but not with Vista.
Why Must We "Move On"?
by Bill Polhemus - 3/15/07 7:29 AM In reply to: Windows Vista Bugs by photohamI must admit I'm perplexed at the seemingly unquestioned premise that you MUST "move on" to something different from what you have been using.
Far be it from me to assume that I know your computing needs better than you do yourself, but it does occur to me that the "movers and shakers" in the computing world--from the pundits at places like CNET to the software and hardware merchants themselves--have been able to convince a great many users, with very little effort, that they must now be dissatisfied with the system that until recently was more than adequate for their needs, and purchase the latest and greatest.
It's often called "upgrade-itis," a disease spread by casual contact with enthusiastic evangelists with an agenda in mind (mostly to move merchandise and sell subscriptions).
I admit there was a time when it was easy to be dissatisfied with the status quo ante, as the developments in useful new capabilities or improvements over existing, were rapid and dramatic. Who can argue that the upgrade from plain-jane DOS to Windows 3.x was not thrilling? Or 16-bit Windows to 32-bit?
But in the past half-decade or so, it seems as if all the pundits and pitch-meisters have to go with is "change for the sake of change." You can find quite a few people still happily using Windows 2000, even (or "especially") in business environments. And Windows XP has been around for a LONG time, has seen enhancements in its capabilities, until it really does what the vast majority of PC users need for it to do.
So the question becomes, not "when," but "why do I have to upgrade to Windows Vista anytime soon? What is it going to offer me that I need so badly that I must purchase new hardware and--as seems to be the case now that the genie's out of the bottle--software?"
Why is the status quo ante now not "good enough?" What am I desperately missing?
Perhaps this IS the time to jump to the Mac world. I think they're wonderful machines. For myself, I am using Fedora Linux to pursue my hobby of home studio recording, since the software available (at little or no cost) is as powerful and full-featured as most of the commercial (and expensive) software available on the PC or the Mac, so it suits my needs. I have been using Linux for almost ten years now to power my server for my home network. It's a great tool.
And for all the work-a-day stuff I'm doing now as a practicing structural engineer, Windows XP has and does everything that I need.
I have no interest in switching, and I wonder why so many people seem to feel the need, outside of infection with "upgrade-itis."
vista.
by journeyman4 - 3/15/07 7:30 AM In reply to: Windows Vista Bugs by photohamI think microsoft are at fault, why do we have to keep having "New" stuff, maybe Im old fashioned but windows 2000 windows XP, Windows vista, windows this windows that why not just keep improving and updating relevant things, that would surely save a lot of hassle and expense.
Vista Ready
by sbmunn - 3/15/07 7:32 AM In reply to: Windows Vista Bugs by photohamWith the origional launch date of Vista coming in November 06, i purchaced a Dell vista ready computer to run vista when it came out. Going through the Dell build your computer XPS/9150 I was influenced with several upgrades, being advertised by Dell as recommended upgrades and wanting too be sure it could run Vista I purchased them. The Soundblaster Audigy MB Advanced is now I find out a unsupported software inhancement, Dell says call Creative, Creative says talk to Dell. My CDRom doesnt work, Samsung its Software or Hardware issues. Roxio, Cineplayer, Creative MediaSource are not being patched, they recommend Buying the newest software. Will it fix the problem? My router isnt supported, recommendation buy a new router. I should have expected this from my XP upgrade experience. Now I have a Vista Dual core 3ghz 2gb ram paperweight. Thanks to Microsoft and its allies.
Combination of the Two;
by idiot420 - 3/15/07 7:33 AM In reply to: Windows Vista Bugs by photohamIf Microsoft wasn't such a bunch of pompous butts I would say that third parties were at fault. The problem lies in both groups, MS for being so superiority complexed that they don't have to think of anyone but themselves, and third parties for not doing what they should. I mean it's not like MS didn't announce Vista in too short of time, it's not like MS didn't put betas out on the web without enough time to create patches or develop new programs, Vista compatible. So in parting I would say that for all Apple is so secure, upgrading and switching parts out for newer bigger is a plus for PCs, are by far are the better buy. As for MS and BG, remember karma works in a circle, so just wait and watch.
it's not software, it's an operating system.
by vidyman - 3/15/07 7:38 AM In reply to: Windows Vista Bugs by photohamIf Microsoft just provided an office suit or even a GUI then it would be to blame for incompatibilities for divers and so forth. But vista is an operating system, the core of the computer works. Now when Apple when to system 10 they knew there was going to be major incompatibility issues’, so they created the shell call classic. They also warned the community for years that the change was going to be drastic and publish programs to help developers make the change. BUT (and her is where Microsoft is dropping the ball) they also explained in detail what advantages the new system would have over the old system. Some thing that is not happening with vista .
Wow, congratualtions for slogging through with ME for 6 yrs!
by jaywardle - 3/15/07 7:40 AM In reply to: Windows Vista Bugs by photohamThat was the most shocking part of your message. I dumped that OS after about a month. It really was bad.
Not probably what you want to hear but whenever I buy anything computer-related I plan on only 3 yrs of use. Anything I get past that is gravy. Sounds like you've had this box for 6-7...It's probably time to get some technology underneath you that was not made in the 90's.
Believe me I struggle with my own MS mysteries every day so I'm not defending them, but I'm not sure why you thought something that didn't work on XP would all the sudden work on Vista. Based on what I've been reading I'm not even thinking of upgrading my 3 yr old laptop to vista because of reported poor performance issues on anything that isn't a brand new box.
Sorry for the tough love, just another point of view. Good luck in whatever you do end up doing.
J
I know this not exactly . . . . . .!
by techtype - 3/15/07 7:44 AM In reply to: Windows Vista Bugs by photohamI know this is not exactly Windows Vista. But why is it with Microsoft that people have to upgrade:
Computers (more exact motherboards/Mainboards)
Video Cards
USB connections
Printers
Most hardware
and
Software
Especially software, probably the second biggest investment that a person/family will make to use on the computer. At the very least the software should run from operating system to operating system. There in lays the crux. No this is Microsoft's problem with the incompatibility, not the people buying Windows Vista!
I know this is not Microsoft that I am going to use as an example, but if BIG BLUE IBM can make their upgraded operating system run on their latest and greatest Main Frames and legacy peripherals and above all legacy software (CoBol worked from machine to machine), then why can not Microsoft follow a successful model?
No Microsoft has been doing this since they were contracted to write IBM DOS 1.1. They should have stuck to writing BASIC compilers. By the way in case anyone is interested, Microsoft bought the license to CP/M and converted it to IBM DOS 1.1/Microsoft DOS 1.1. Microsoft did not start out from ground zero like a lot of people would like to think. It was much like TRS DOS although not exact in running.
yeah Vista is the worst relase ever!
by bytlan - 3/15/07 7:47 AM In reply to: Windows Vista Bugs by photohamI'll go one better. Have you ever heard or seen any of Windows 2.xx loaded? I ran it and that was the real WOW! A single platform concept to run software off of with commonality of device usage-printing, modem usage, storage; that made some real sense. This current Vista does not come close to any of that and they are calling it “WOW”. Devices are not compatible, software conflicts. Machine locking down performing tasks making the system loosing focus forcing applications to be unstable and none responsive. And the Security issues that make no rhyme or reasoning sense! I am running at the Admin level and I still don’t have all the permissions to work with this box - I tried backing areas up and was denied access. I tried to move files and got hit with read only aspects and access denied that were placed somehow after I created the Directory. This was after I went in and reapplied ownership rights to the entire drive as administrator and had a separate pass wording applied. Right now I am in the dungeons and dragons of this mess. My first few days of the 512 k memory, I about died! Total disbelief that the OS could not function with out nearly stopping all operations and preventing basic operations from completing tasks... Another GIG chip added to the memory and a little bit better. And this is a home PC. This is a faster box with all the hardware and loads more memory then I have ever had in any PC and it is the doggiest machine I have run since my 286 with emulation processing of 386 with a math co processor.
Currently some other things have happened and the tech people are saying I need to rebuild this PC from the ground up. It lost all antivirus integrity which started a cascading effect, I lost my printing ability, CPU computing runs near to 100% most all the time, hangs have become more frequent – DEP issues locking out the Explorer Navigation and then restarting and can’t access hard drive areas even further - lock down. The VS 2005 Express has lost much of its interface ability. Other applications have reported more errors and lost usage all together as many of the application GUI forms have not been able to open - probably not appearing on the screen is the case because it can’t route itself. This is in no way possible of WOW advertising. This purchase was a forced replacement machine as a power supply of the USB circuit traced through the mother board over loading and fired it all – minus the hard drives.
There is loads more I can write on this subject. I got an old box running and a labtop that are functionally more productive then this new box. Oh I have built servers and had less security issues running it then this current stuff.
Microsoft should ensure compatibility of current software!
by domainxess - 3/15/07 8:00 AM In reply to: Windows Vista Bugs by photohamI think this is an easy answer, atleast for me. Microsoft should have made sure that Vista supported all software or whatever that was currently supported. They took long enough to release it that this seems like a no brainer, b/c it is not as if they had a date, or atleast one that was set in stone, & had to push it out. The 3rd party sofware vendors should make sure that any software/hardware etc.. released after this is compatible, but I believe that microsoft should ensure compatibility when Vista was released. Did the vendors even know that the software/hardware would not be compatible for sure? And even if so, with all the delays made by microsoft how would they really know when to update it or release a new version for shelves at the stores?
I know some disagree with this, but I just think that Microsoft should have made this a priority. I bought a new laptop just before the release & have the option to upgrade it to VIsta, but honestly I'm leaning towards keeping XP. Atleast, for a while b/c you know there will be several more issues that come out & I don't know why i'd really want to upgrade to something that is so new- remember when XP first came out! And i'm not saying XP is perfect, but atleast it has had time for the major issues to be found & corrected..
Just my opinion
Microsoft ultimately suffers
by srudis - 3/15/07 8:01 AM In reply to: Windows Vista Bugs by photohamVista is a Microsoft product and the fact that it does not work well is their fault. If Lexus made a care with bad brakes would they be saying it is not our fault it is the one who makes the brakes? Microsoft knew what was changing and should have given that information to other companies. It then should have made sure that a sufficient number of drivers were working before releasing their product. I just returned a new laptop because of Vista. I tried to buy the same computer with XP but it is no longer available. If Microsoft took extra time to release to fix the bugs, the shuld have take time to make all problems were worked out. The end user does not care why Vista does not work, they only know it is a flop.
Steve
Printers that simply won's work
by Ivan Orellana - 3/15/07 8:12 AM In reply to: Windows Vista Bugs by photohamHi, I bought a new laptop pc with Windows Vista (unfortunately 4 or 5 days before Vista's release, XP pc's were not being sold so I bought this one on January the 30th), I had a Canon Multipass C755 all in one and simply won't work. At Canon's 1-800 they say there will be no relaese of the driver for this new OS, but they can give me a discount (10%) for loyalty if I get a new machine from them, of course I won't do that, they should be giving support for the products they sell,for some hardware makers all is only about bu$ine$$ and along with Microsoft also take advantage to sell more forcing people to upgrade their equipment.
"we" are at fault
by wcoffey81 - 3/15/07 8:17 AM In reply to: Windows Vista Bugs by photohamwe as consumers are the ones at fault. in our hunt to have the latest and greatest we now put quality in the backseat. if we still demanded 1st rate quality companies would be forced to deliver just that. instead we lay down our hard earned cash for products that are not quite ready or just plain buggy with a sometimes empty promise that "we will get everything corrected later". IT'S OUR OWN FAULT!!!
I say...
by meisinscotland - 3/15/07 6:33 PM In reply to: "we" are at fault by wcoffey81I say we should all throw the rulebook out of the Window and go back to Windows 95 
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