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Community Newsletter: Q&A: 2/9/07 Is the Linux operating system for me?
- 2/9/07 5:00 PM
That's how it's always been done
by clsgis - 2/22/07 11:31 AM In reply to: Getting Writers by capt36"What would NOT be difficult to do is for a writer who moderately understands a distro or an application, team up with a true god-like Lord of the Empire Technical Geek (I mean that lovingly), and the two do a book."
I've had to buy the book for most of the major FOSS applications I use. Metafont, TeX, LaTeX (three books), UUCP, Qmail, Postfix, PostgreSQL, Perl (three editions), BIND (three editions), Apache, Netfilter (three network security titles). I'll probably by an Openoffice.org book. There are just too many things I haven't figured out how to make OOo do. (Current hangs, how to I adjust line spacing within and between paragraphs? How do I export a .DOC file without destroying the layout/formatting I used frames for? How do I get bullet lists to indent items properly?) All of these titles come out of some kind of collaboration between professional technical writers and the developers on the project. That's because I've learned (the hard way) to avoid the junk books cranked out by hack writers in a weekend. The right book will often have one of the developers as a co-author, or a preface or introduction by one of the developers. It's usually the O'Reilly Associates title, but No Starch Press and Apress are coming on strong. The Metafont-TeX-LaTeX books are on Addison-Wesley.
Unfortunately, the distributions are too big and move too fast for this kind of treatment to work very well. The books I've been happiest can be used first as a tutorial and later as a reference. They can do it because they are only treating one topic. Should a book about a distribution go into detail about how to set up one of its packages, say Postfix? Where should it stop and send you to the Postfix book? This is the problem the Linux Documentation Project HOWTO documents were supposed to address. Unfortunately TLDP chose a single-source authoring format (Docbook SGML) whose tools were so difficult to get working and learn that most of the authors bailed rather than adopt it.
Hibernate and suspend
by clsgis - 2/9/07 2:08 PM In reply to: gradual by RobocoastieThere are at least three kinds of "hibernate" and "suspend" available to Linux users: APM, ACPI, and "user mode suspend 2."
Intel is pushing ACPI. Everything has to work perfectly: drivers, BIOS, daemons.
Older laptops have APM. BIOS basically handles it for you. Requires "APM support" in the kernel, and user programs apm and apmd, much simpler to install correctly but fewer features. Some distros don't install it by default.
User suspend 2 is the most primitive. It was invented because so many systems have broken APM or ACPI, or none. Doesn't require any BIOS support to suspend to disk. No daemon to configure. Included in many distros' default kernels. All it does is snapshot the system and hide the snapshot either in RAM or the swap partition. When you boot next, a user-suspend2 aware kernel looks for the hidden snapshot and restores from it if it finds one. It's worked on every system where I've tried it, where APM and ACPI are broken or nonexistent.
Are you sure user-suspend2 doesn't work with your proprietary 3d graphics driver in place? If not, that's a bug, and the user-suspend2 project would appreciate hearing from you about it.
2/9/06 Is the Linux operating system for me?
by carrb - 2/9/07 6:21 AM In reply to: 2/9/07 Is the Linux operating system for me? by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
I myself have been considering a Linux system and the responses supplied are so helpful. This is one of the best technical websites available. To all, Thank You.
Linux IS the OS for you if:
by btberlin - 2/9/07 8:58 AM In reply to: 2/9/06 Is the Linux operating system for me? by carrbThere is lots of helpful advice in the previous answers about Linux, but, let me add a few words. I use Linux both at work and at home. At work, my objective is to have "office productivity" tools with as little fuss about the environment that the tools work in as possible. So, after experimenting for months at a time with various distros (kubuntu - wouldn't install on my hardware, CentOS 4.x - problems with file shares, slackware - too geeky, and so on) I settled on Suse 10.2. For office use, it is stable, provides all the resources (productivity software) that I need, and provides, through KDE (or Gnome) a very friendly work environment. I use firefox for browsing, thunderbird for email, and openoffice for productivity and good compatibility with MS office documents, spread sheets, and presentations. I don't need the various movie players (we don't allow streaming music or video on our network anyhow). I do use VMWare to provide a win 2k environment in order to do some work-related tasks that require windows -- like Visio. The system is stable, provides occasional updates for security and other useful enhancement (but not to the point of being a nuisance). It never crashes or freezes, and I never reboot. If you are just trying to get some work done, it's a really good choice.
At home, I use CentOS 4.4 - it is easier to do some of the geeky things I need, like use the computer as the pppoe client for my dsl connection, provide firewalling and other network services for my home network of 6 computers. But, for relatively comfortable migration, I highly recommend Suse 10.2
yes
by emiliacom1 - 2/9/07 11:53 AM In reply to: Linux IS the OS for you if: by btberlinI have been using linux for about three years. It has definitely gotten better. The wifi in Ubuntu is great! I use Linux for surfing the internet and a few other things but have to use Windows for my Sims 2 game. If that was able to be run under Linux I would say bye bye for good.
Hmm
by FocusedWolf - 2/9/07 6:23 AM In reply to: 2/9/07 Is the Linux operating system for me? by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
I have used alot of operating systems (mac, xp pro, various linux distros {fedora, mandrake, suse, redhat}, and i saw vista the other day at the store...until trying it, i thought it was the greatest thing in the world, but now its just an os lol). <- see the vista remark...i was excited about an os i never even used.
All os's are the same fundementally. some require more under-the-hood maintence then others... i.e. all linux's when you start to really use it. Mac and windows are the same...they just crash differant. It's like having a stack of phone books from differant states... sure they look differant and have differant names but they perform the same and they steal each others features. The point is...don't go to mac for the sake of going to mac...and don't go to linux unless theirs a reason.
The most important question is what software do you wish to run...how much patience do you have to overcome every software and hardware problem you get, which equals close to as much software and hardware that you got...and more importantely do you play any windows videogames that you intend to get working in linux using wine or some wine-based emulation. If no games, then is their programs in linux that will fullfill your every need, presant and forseable future. (their probably is, except for games,...but not every opensource program is as fullfeatured as firefox... some are no more extravigant then wordpad.exe). Also god help you if your audiocard or mouse aren't compatible.
Here's a great example... got a mouse with more then 3 buttons? by default only 3 will work... if you got a m$ mouse then you have to download some community made software that comes in sourcecode form and compile it.
the commands would be like open terminal
cd /root/<main folder of the source code for this thing>
su su means super user...its like vista new thing with limited user accounts and having to enter one everytime you install something...yea same principle
<the root "admin" password>
./configure
make
make install
any one of the last 3 commands can fail if you dont have the right code development libraries installed on your linux... and that means you didn't do a full install of linux and instead clicked the icon for "desktop use" lol
Ok maybe there are things that are pre-installed on your ubuntu... but when you start to use linux like you use windows then you will encounter this and it will be hard... http://www.linuxquestions.org/ you're gonna need it... why dont you do a username search for "focusedwolf" and see how i was when i first used linux.
Another situation...what kind of videocard do you have...ati? or hopefully nvidia which are more linux compatible... if you only intend to used 2d software then this doesnt really matter, but if you intend for 3d effects...then your gonna have to install the proper linux drivers for your computer and no their is no windowsupdate equilivant that autoinstalls drivers. (ahh yum, the best updater...doesn't hang and stall like typical "busy" linux windows...good ole console based commands heh).
I wanted to find something that summed up ubuntu nvidia videocard installing, but this is the best i found for my quick search: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=57368 I only glanced at it and recognized the config file modding you gotta do from similiar fedora nvidia-install's..
My overall opinion... if you get linux...then you WILL WORK to get stuff to work as easily as it does in windows... you will be a master of the terminal if you learn linux, and you will most definatally screw it up on average of 5 times after installing it, resulting in formating if off just to reinstall to undo mistakes you made while setting up some hardware... Like what happened to me when i decided i didnt need to do a full install...and then couldnt compile certain programs that i needed for my mouse and videocard and other stuff.
ok this is to long...im not proofreading it lol.
my professional opinion is vista is good... it has things under the hood that only a sofware writer could appreciate... it will mean startrek 3d interfaces in all software, as soon as people can learn and master xaml designing lol
Also i got office 2007 at home on my xp system and i gotta say its the best most comfortable office program i have ever used in comparison to office 2003...and i did try openoffice in linux, like when i had a dual boot setup going, and my windows side died and needed to work on some office 2003 word documents. It is a joke in comparison to word varients...but it is just good enough to type some dribble in an emergency and get some kind of rudimentary spellcheck going.
hmm++
by FocusedWolf - 2/9/07 6:33 AM In reply to: Hmm by FocusedWolfO one more thing...if you do a dualboot setup ...your supposed to install windows first on one partition, then use a program like partition magic and make like a 20gb partition for linux and, i forget the size, but a swap partition for linux aswell...i dont remember if it was 2gb or around that... also if your smart then your current system has 10gb of space reserved for windows and the rest of your harddrive for programs that you install...this whey when windows dies you can format c:\ ...reinstall...and then you dont loose all your important stuff.
ok point of this is if you do a dual install of linux and windows... and something happens...you install an updated linux kernel or something... and the dual-booting dialog doesnt come up to select windows or linux...and your panicking... then their is a solution with the windows xp cd... run its recovery console tools and type "fixmbr" and it will get the windows side working atleast... lol linux is like a box of pre-cut metal and a welder...
partitioning for dual boot
by clsgis - 2/9/07 2:47 PM In reply to: hmm++ by FocusedWolf"O one more thing...if you do a dualboot setup ...your supposed to install windows first on one partition, then use a program like partition magic and make like a 20gb partition for linux and, i forget the size, but a swap partition for linux aswell..."
Huh?
I've always partitioned a new hard drive with Linux' fdisk or cfdisk. Just make the first partition type NTFS, the next partition Linux swap, and the rest of the partitions whatever. When you install MS-Windows it will use the NTFS partition and pretend the others aren't there. At least it worked that way through Windows-2K.
The swap partition should be twice or three times the size of physical RAM. If you expect to double your RAM next year, just make it six times so you don't have to fiddle with it again.
help me
by abhilashveeyes - 2/9/07 6:33 AM In reply to: 2/9/07 Is the Linux operating system for me? by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
i am one of the customer of asianet broadband internet connection and running an internet cafe in attingal.i configered one system as server and other three as clients in a common work group. but i am able to access the net only on the server.so please give me some instructions for how to configure the net and network.expecting your immediate replay...................
wrong forum, answer anyway
by clsgis - 2/9/07 12:53 PM In reply to: help me by abhilashveeyesHi abhilashveeyes, you're in the wrong forum for that question and you didn't tell us enough to answer it. Please read "How to Ask Questions the Smart Way." http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html
If you're asking about an MS-windows setup, please, please, reconsider your decision. We are getting blasted by spam and viruses from Asianet Broadband customers whose MS-Windows systems are compromised. Asianet doesn't seem interested in controlling it, and that is why a lot of North American and European networks are blocking your email. It is *really hard* to make a secure bastion server using MS-Windows. Please use an operating system that was *designed* to be exposed directly to the Internet on a routable IP address. MS-Windows, despite what your salesman tells you, is not designed to be used that way.
Whether you're asking about Linux or MS-Windows, you should find a local professional to help you. It's easy to set up a Linux system to be a firewall, router, email server, and workstation, all at once. (But you really shouldn't. Don't put anything on your firewall machine but the firewall.) But you have to know what you're doing to maintain it and keep it secure enough to bet your business on it. Get someone to show you. That's how people learn any operating system.
I put an all-purpose system like that in a local non-profit in 2003. All their workstations can see out, but nobody can see in. We use the Linux netfilter feature called IP Masquerade. (Cisco calls the same function "many-to-one network address translation with connection tracking.") Read the Linux IP Masquerade HOWTO.
I keep it updated from home. The only attention it ever needed was when some spazz threw it on the floor and cracked the motherboard. Last week I updated it from Debian 3.1 to 4.0, remotely, and broke the firewall! If I had *read the 4.0 release notes* first I would have known what changed and how to turn the firewall back on. And this varies from one distro to the next. You have to read the instructions for your distro.
It all depends on
by sntnlz75 - 2/9/07 6:41 AM In reply to: 2/9/07 Is the Linux operating system for me? by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
Dear Patti,
Six years ago frustrated by Windows OS and Windows-based applications problems (crashes mostly) I started my migration to Linux and I did it with what was then Mandrake Linux 9 and kept upgrading to newer releases when the were made available(Mandrake has become Mandriva and release 9 is now 2007).
I stayed away from the very popular Red Hat Linux 9 and all the way to Fedora Core because of a very simple reason which in my opinion should be enough for anyone trying to make a shift. IF IT GIVES YOU TROUBLE WHILE STILL IN THE INSTALLATION PHASE THEN YOU DON'T WANT IT. Because that is usually followed by some other problems if you get to finish the installation with a bit of tweaking here and there.
Being a very picky person 'as my wife says' about everything including my productivity which relies heavily on my computer and data, I didn't venture with other distributions (aka distros) until I switched to Novell's OpenSUSE 10.2 last year. I had kept my Win XP all that time for what I later discovered to be nostalgic reasons because I wouldn't even log into it twice a month and I was doing zero tasks on it. So got rid of it recently and replaced it with Sun's Solaris 10 which is great but highly unrecommended for would be UNIX beginners.
Now the hardware issue is not a problem because if you're willing to pay >$1,000 for an MS Windows OS and MS Office upgrade and more for a brand new bundle, you will likely pay <25% of that to replace hardware that isn't compatible with the OS you've chosen. Do your homework first and see what is supported by your OS of choice and whether you have it or need to buy it and for how much.
As for your data, everything (files not applications) I had on Windows works just fine on Linux. All MS Office documents are manageable by OpenOffice.org (today's release is 2.1) and the suite is always a few steps ahead of MS Office when it comes to interoperability with other office suites. Media files (such as mp3, mp4, avi, wmv...etc) all have applications to run them on Linux (remember my experience is with Mandrivan Linux and OpenSUSE). Keep in mind that if you actually buy a Linux distro, it will most probably come proprietary (commercial) drivers and applications that might ease your shift. So explore that option when you make up your mind on what to get.
Final words are, if you're thinking about it, this probably means you've had it with what you have (Windows) and migrating is a good option. Do it the right way and you'll reap the benefits sooner than you think. People have suggested using live CDs, I think it's a good idea but it will get you nowhere productivity-wise , I would recommend dual-booting your system if you know how to accomplish that without destroying your data. Running a system from a live CD (I tried it once just out of curiosity) is too slow as you can imagine. REMEMBER TO BACK UP YOUR DATA BEFORE YOU TRY ANYTHING, you'll never know what might make your NTLDR unhappy 
Linux?
by deBohun - 2/9/07 7:00 AM In reply to: 2/9/07 Is the Linux operating system for me? by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
Assuming I knew you to be a laymen, without professional technical training,... if I disliked you, I might tell you to stick with Windows. If I hated you, I would suggest Linux. As an end-user system, it is only appropriate for geeks who don't need things like off-the-shelf printer support, standard device drivers for modem, graphics, and audio cards, and who don't mind having to go backward 30 years to the command line every time they run into a problem that no one was bothered to write a graphical interface for. You can guess what I'd recommend if I liked you.
Indeed
by khaostech - 2/9/07 1:28 PM In reply to: Linux? by deBohunLinux indeed ! Why oh why go there. Out of curiousity I tried Ubuntu first, then following a suggestion from another user, I next tried Mandriva.
After several suicide attempts ( just kidding) I gladly gave the whole Linux thing up for good...
Returning to windows, I quickly gained my sanity back...
Need I say more... D
The MStrix
by clsgis - 2/9/07 3:16 PM In reply to: Indeed by khaostechMost people choose the blue pill, and they're happy dreaming in their pods.
http://us.imdb.com/title/tt0133093/
To Ubuntu or not to Ubuntu
by Barry Kooda - 2/9/07 7:32 AM In reply to: 2/9/07 Is the Linux operating system for me? by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
I dove right in and loaded Ubuntu 6.10 on my laptop and when I booted it up, it said there were updates available. 113 updates. The next day, It had 33 updates available. I'll have to agree with you about the "stable" thing and perhaps I should try another, more stable version of Linux for my virgin voyage.
Good info. Thanks!
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