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Computer newbies: Newbie's shouldn't jump to Firefox Browser
Thanks for having Courage
by cscoder - 10/14/05 9:56 AM In reply to: Newbie's shouldn't jump to Firefox Browser by skyaceWhen I read your post I knew the anti-MS crowd would explode. Reasonable opinions are not appreciated if they suggest anything not-Microsoft may have problems. At least you gave them a forum to legitiametely flame away. Hope it will decrease the arbitrary flaming that pollute so many of the threads.
That goes for not-Microsoft flamers as well. For instance, I hate Symantec and AOL, but you won't find me bringing that up on a thread that has nothing to do with them. :>)
I'm no expert but Firefox is indeed a breath of fresh air ..
by ps646566 - 10/14/05 10:46 AM In reply to: Newbie's shouldn't jump to Firefox Browser by skyaceI'm no tecchie or expert, but I just knew enough to know that IE and Outlook Express are bad news because of being constantly targetted by the malware morons.
Usually I am an "if it ain't broke don't fix it" person, but was persuaded to try Firefox and Thunderbird. I found them extremely easy to download, install, and use and have not looked back. You certainly don't need any degree of sophisticated knowledge (let alone an understanding of Linux -- totally irrelevant) to use these products.
Drawbacks ? A few websites will not work on Firefox but that's because they've opted to use MS's version of HTML rather than the approved standard. Backing up e-mail is not particularly easy. You have to review the Mozilla website for updates, they don't alert you. Apart from that I have found Mozilla to be all good news, and am not sure why anyone would want to knock these products.
you are kidding, right?
by buckassociates - 10/14/05 1:04 PM In reply to: Newbie's shouldn't jump to Firefox Browser by skyacei've had no more problems with firefox, than i have had with netscape, ie, opera, or even slim browser. they all work good, they just don't always work! some spyware jumps in, changes your settings, and guess what, your pages no longer load.
my advice would be, try them all, and use the one that makes the most sense, or that you are most comfortable with, and let's not start another browser war.
I BEG TO DIFFER.
by 9100107 - 10/14/05 1:34 PM In reply to: Newbie's shouldn't jump to Firefox Browser by skyaceI think that only a person working with Microsoft, Microsoft lover, Mozilla hater, or a person that likes getting hacked and spyware would say a horrible think like that! Firefox is FAR better than IE or any other browser, in fact. Newbies, don't listen to this person - he just wants to hack your computer. If you REALLY don't want Firefox or Mozilla, at least get Opera. But PLEASE don't use IE until Version 7 is released. Actually, with so many other great browsers out there, the only thing you SHOULD use it for is ActiveX, and even that you can sometimes run in Firefox with the right extensions.
Webpage rendering problems
by TONI H - 10/15/05 1:53 AM In reply to: I BEG TO DIFFER. by 9100107My website has a javascript menu....IE and Netscape (all versions, even older 4.79) render that menu just fine; FF does not and still can't. I've never installed Opera to test my site with because there just aren't enough users of Opera anymore to bother working with my code to make it work for them to be honest, but was really disappointed to know I would have to jump through hoops for FF to get it to show correctly. I don't know how many users there are who still use Netscape on a regular basis, but if even one of their oldest versions can see my menu correctly and the majority of the world using IE can see it correctly, FF is the one with the issues that needs to be corrected as far as I'm concerned.
I realize that IE is more 'code error friendly' and always has been, but evidently so is Netscape....why would FF have to be so strict that pages render like garbage and yet be so 'popular' in their inflexability? That doesn't appear to me to be 'user friendly' at all.
Look at my website in all three browsers I've mentioned, and you'll see how unbending FF is when it comes to page rendering...even if the coding is CORRECT for it. If FF wants me as a customer, they're going to have to accommodate the customer and not themselves to do it.
http://www.pcwarfare.com
TONI
Noobies NOT use Firefox?
by scayf - 10/14/05 1:40 PM In reply to: Newbie's shouldn't jump to Firefox Browser by skyaceCare to explain WHY?
cough*troll*cough
I believe that newbies could start off with either IE of FF
by ackmondual - 10/14/05 2:23 PM In reply to: Newbie's shouldn't jump to Firefox Browser by skyace..... And be just fine.
For both, the user needs to learn how to if not set up AV, anti-ad/spyware, and firewall apps, then how to use it or get help when needed and common sense in internet surfing.
I started off in IE. Starting from '04 and a year later, i was forced to clean install due to all that crap i accumulated caused my PC to come to a crawl. I was internet aware then (don't click on flash ads, popup windows, etc.), but did learn a few new tricks. First tiem i only had AV app. Now i've also added various anti-ad/spyware apps and a firewall. Since then, IE nor unwanted junk has not given me any problems.
I still use IE. Like certain others here, i'm too lazy to DL FF and instlal it. I have no doubt that FF is great with its own niceties, but I tend to stick with what work, so IE is here to stay.
IE newbies need to be extra careful and have protection.
FF newbies still need protection, but less so since with less attacks against FF, it'll get hit with 70% less malicious code than IE. FF newbies should be aware of to use IE only when needed for certain sites is all
Caution warning of Firefox, OK, but what are the problems?
by plwertz - 10/14/05 2:40 PM In reply to: Newbie's shouldn't jump to Firefox Browser by skyaceThe warning concerning newbies jumping into Firefox may be valid but the commentator never said why Firefox might be a problem, particularly to newbies. He writes many words of warning but he doesn't say why the warning! What does it do that is so bad? What specifically do the other clients do that Firefox doesn't or that it doesn't do as well.
FF doesn't render webpages as well
by TONI H - 10/15/05 1:58 AM In reply to: Caution warning of Firefox, OK, but what are the problems? by plwertzas Netscape and IE....and I've heard it all before about how IE doesn't care if the coding for the site is wrong, it will still render it correctly. With all the new html editing programs (what you see if what you get types such as Dreamweaver and Front Page) out there, the coding has gotten much better at being correct so the chances of errors unless you are manually typing the coding and have a typo are getting to be less and less often. But FF is so unbending that even when the coding is correct, it won't render the page properly without your jumping through hoops rewriting your coding to accommdate FF that it's just not worth the effort. See my post above about this issue.
TONI
100% wrong
by RodonGoldCoast - 10/16/05 3:54 PM In reply to: FF doesn't render webpages as well by TONI HAny web developer using asp.net will have problems getting the site read by Firefox browsers. This is not technicaly a problem with the programming, only that MS has not listed Firefox as a modern browser in its software packages so the site written will automatically render only what a pre IE5 browser could read. Simply a case of MS undermining its competition. There are workarounds but there are still too many lazy developers who only use wiziwig type packages or who only want to write sites for IE. We can argue with them forever but at the end of the day, any serious users of the www need to keep IE available. I am a FF user but need to use IE for internet banking because both banks that I have accounts with don't recognise FF. As to the original conversation on whether newbies should use FF, I don't think it is that bad but newbies may have difficulties figuring out why they cannot access some web sites.
You contradict yourself
by TONI H - 10/19/05 4:31 AM In reply to: 100% wrong by RodonGoldCoastI'm not a lazy developer, but I'm also not an expert (nor do I need to be) at hand-writing code for a personal website. Dreamweaver used to recommended by all experts in its original format; however, even Dreamweaver has gone to WYSIWYG (what you see is what you get) for creating websites. Front Page always has been. For home users, and not professional, complex, complicated companies, having the ability to type or add graphics and have 'what you see' is 'what you get' for coding is normally 'good enough'. I go further to make sure my code is correct for how I want it to appear by installing other browsers for the sole purpose of checking how my site is rendered by them. Firefox fails my test only because it doesn't support javascript for my menu well and shifts it to the side. The rest of the site and its content comes through just fine, and I'm not about to jump through hoops trying to get FF to render such a simple code. It isn't important enough to me after much digging into my code to try to figure out anymore why FF is so restrictive....it's their problem and not mine to work at to correct it. Netscape and IE have no problems with it.
But even you make the claim that 'any serious users of the www need to keep IE available' because even professional, complex, complicated sites such as your bank aren't going to go to the trouble of re-writing their sites for the sake of one particular browser out there if the two major players AT THIS TIME can enter and view their site. FF needs to do some bending in order to reach the top of the heap and realize that not everybody out there will be willing to go to that expense.
Netscape, for years, had the same unbending attitude when it came to developing their product into something better in addition to continuing to charge for something that their competitors were giving away for free and where did it get them? They finally woke up to the fact that they needed to accommodate the customers and give them what the customers found appealing....it's time for FF to also wake up and smell the coffee when it comes to 'customer service'. Just because right now it's 'more secure' than IE doesn't mean much if they aren't flexible with rendering pages well enough to make people want the product.
TONI
I always thought IE rendered properly until...
by RussH - 10/19/05 2:30 PM In reply to: FF doesn't render webpages as well by TONI HI saw this web site:
http://www.howtocreate.co.uk/wrongWithIE/
Take a dare. Visit this site with any Mozilla browser and compare the results with IE. You will be shocked. Yes it takes a little time to go through all 27 examples where IE fails to render properly coded pages, but it is time well spent.
Needless to say, FF renders these pages just fine.....
Firefox too rough for "newbies"?
by mudman5 - 10/14/05 2:54 PM In reply to: Newbie's shouldn't jump to Firefox Browser by skyaceSo, Skyace..........I think you have besmirched the level of proficiency of "newbies" the world over. I have been using Firefox since it was only a beta and I have had no issues that would trouble anyone who was smart enough to boot up a computer. Perhaps you have relatives living in Microsoft land....
Firefox/ Mozilla and other alternatives
by mierr - 10/14/05 3:30 PM In reply to: Newbie's shouldn't jump to Firefox Browser by skyaceHi all !
I've been reading some of the replays to your message and I think it's far enought for the topic. My experience is that if you don't have a clue about internet treaths and how to protect your computer, no matter the browser you use, your system will be wasted and your secret files stollen or corrupted. So please, do some job before going on-line or ask for help from a trusted party.
By the way, I have switched to Linux a few years ago, been a newby. and even thouth I know there are some risks in linux too, I have never had to clean or repair my system anymore.
http://www.ubuntu.com/newsitems/release510
http://fedora.redhat.com/
http://www.opensuse.org/Download
Best regards
Why not?
by spy HH - 10/14/05 4:13 PM In reply to: Newbie's shouldn't jump to Firefox Browser by skyacewhen i was newbie i used firefox and i didn't had any problem?=!!!
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