Community Newsletter: Q&A: 4/22/05 Should I buy or build a computer?
- 4/22/05 2:56 PM
Should I buy or build a computer?
by douglaspjones - 4/22/05 1:58 PM In reply to: 4/22/05 Should I buy or build a computer? by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
Hello, Kenny.
I have built two computers from scratch and very much enjoyed the experience. I have also upgraded and repaired computers for many friends as a result of the knowledge I gained.
One practical tip. If you have a good local supplier of the components, I suggest you buy them all from the same place. That way, you won't have far to go if you have to return any items and you won't have to wait for delivery. Don't forget the graphics card, either. It seems that most recent motherboards don't have on-board graphics or a place to connect the monitor!
Do ask your supplier(s) for advice - they will almost certainly be able to advise whether your shopping list is complete (and compatible).
If you do any sound recording,including transferring recordings from a minidisk recorder, cassette or record deck, you'll need a soundcard with a 'line in' socket. Note that notebooks generally don't have one of these (much to my recent distress) but that PCs generally do. It'd be worth clarifying the point with your supplier, though there is a way around the problem if you attach an external sound card with a line-in facility via your USB port.
Kindest regards,
Douglas.
Build !
by jeffl7777 - 4/22/05 5:03 PM In reply to: 4/22/05 Should I buy or build a computer? by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
As others have pointed out, building your own machine provides the flexibility to build to your requirements. I personally found the actual build straightforward, but i had the advantage of buying all the pieces from a local DIY shop, whose advice on the selection of components was invaluable (they also had all the components). My machine has been spinning discs for a year now, trouble free.
When you build yourself though, you can do three things which are not easily done with an off the shelf commercial machine:
1) buy a big box and extra fans to keep the electronics cooler, for reliability and future expansion,
2) buy a big power supply for future expansion,
3) get a clear cabinet window and add those cool blue, red or green cabinet lights. Nothing beats that.
I have built two out of three of my computers
by 1JohnM - 4/22/05 5:18 PM In reply to: 4/22/05 Should I buy or build a computer? by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
I built two computers and found that I could customize them the way I wanted, that they were faster, more reliable (one is still running after 4 years)and it was actually cheaper than buying them from a reliable company. It took some time to research the componets and make sure that they were all compatable. It took about two days time to make sure everything was installed properly.
My third computer I bought because I could not buy and build the computer for the same amount of money. This computer had to be repaired twice while under warranty but has worked fine since.
i say build
by thermos - 4/22/05 6:31 PM In reply to: 4/22/05 Should I buy or build a computer? by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
when u purchase a computer off the shelf you have to think about how well it can upgrade. most of your pr-built computers have limited upgrade ability, so it will be less time before you have to start with a new computer all over again. if you're looking for something that doesn't have to be a kick ass machine, you should build one to the specs you want, but make sure you choose a mother board that is easily, and highly upgradeable. also, i like to mix-and-match sometimes. i have three home built pc's, and when i decide i need more ram, or more hard drive space in one computer than i do in another, i can easily swap parts. parts swapping with prebuilt computers is often difficult, and requires good experience to do so. most prebuilt computers use hd's, video, and sound cards that can't be swapped into ofther computers. they are designed specifically for one computer and to swap them into another computer creates a huge headache. as far as money goes, you may not necissarily save now, but the right mother board selection will save you money on upgrades in the future. just do a little research before you start buying parts and you'll do just fine
btw: when i built my first computer just 2 years ago, i had absolutely no experience what-so-ever. i hadn't even owned a computer in over 5 years when i decided to build my own. just proof that you don't have to be "good" with computers to build one. now i am the "computer guru" to everyone in my barracks building thanks to the knowledge i have gained by building my own system
good luck with you computer building, and i hope it is as easy for you as it was for me.
nate b
cp stanley, korea
should I build a ne pc?--replay
by siara1705 - 4/22/05 7:34 PM In reply to: 4/22/05 Should I buy or build a computer? by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
yes you should, Just resarch parts you want. I build my first PC two years ago. I had used knowledge from book "computers for dumies", Assembling parts took me 3 hours, then I spend next day at figuring out all the switches. In two days my PC was running Xp and all components were installed. A major advantage for building own PC is that you will have all drivers for every component.
I disagree with Loo about savings
by avpro747 - 4/22/05 7:47 PM In reply to: 4/22/05 Should I buy or build a computer? by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
I have to disagree with Loo about savings. Over the long run building your machine does save money.
To give you an idea as to how long I’ve been using PC's my first was a Radio Shack Model I. I started repairing my own machines with my RS Model III. I stated building my own machines after my first IBM PC AT when motherboards became 100% IBM compatible. The cost of an AT at the time was about $4000.
My first full tower case saw 3 motherboard & CPU upgrades. Total cost was less than $200 for each upgrade. My last upgrade was to an Intel Celeron 2.8Ghz. Cost - $175 for the motherboard and processor. Where it not for a motherboard design change to the ATX planform I would still be using the same case.
Since I re-use the same HDD's I don't have to re-install my programs as you would if you purchase a new machine each time you want to upgrade - a huge savings in time and effort. If you assign a dollar value to your time then you save money with that as well. In addition, you can selectively upgrade your system replacing the systems multimedia - monitor, video card, sound card, etc., for example - and have the latest and the greatest without buying a whole system.
OEM computer builders are not fools. They know what the automakers learned decades ago. There's lot's of money to be made in repairs and upgrades. For that reason a distinct disadvantage to buying OEM is that they frequently use proprietary components. The more costly and powerful the machine the more likely it is to have proprietary equipment, which you may not be able to buy should you decide to repair or upgrade your own machine.
If I were to have purchased a complete new machine each time I wanted an upgrade I would have spent tens of thousands of dollars by now.
The Ultimate Question: To Buy or To Build?
by hold2file - 4/22/05 7:51 PM In reply to: 4/22/05 Should I buy or build a computer? by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
I regret that I missed the original post and am coming late to this discussion. (I was probably doing something stupid like working.)
The Philosophical Answer to your (“How many angels can fit on the head of a pin”) question is that “When ever any Technology becomes Sufficiently Obsolete, it becomes an Art Form.” The easiest examples of this concept are “music” and “painting” which used to be the primary forms of human communication before the alphabet was invented, however, ask any Ham Radio operator if they noticed that the Morse Code was dropped from the Boy Scout Handbook a few years ago and you will understand why they fail to realize how obsolete their Ham Radio skills have become. (The concept of Obsolete Technology is the antonym to Arthur Clarke’s Third law about sufficiently Advanced Technology appearing as Magic.)
The “bottom line” answer to the question about building your own computer is dependent upon the individual’s needs and motivations: Are you building the computer as a tool or are you building the computer as an art form?
If you need the computer as a tool for work, then go to the computer specialty store, hand them your credit card for the box and software you need, and go back to work.
If you are building the computer as an art form, then have fun putting it together and hopefully you will have time and room for it as well as the motorcycle and boat you likely also have.
Jim Allen
Build It, You know you want to
by davehm - 4/22/05 7:57 PM In reply to: 4/22/05 Should I buy or build a computer? by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
The way you worded your question I'm guessing you aren't either a hard core gamer nor someone who has to have the cutting edge stuff. In fact I'm wondering if you are even running XP.
That said building your own is an experiance that will give you untold satisfaction. There are pit falls and you will have little tech support but if you've lived with your curent machine this long you have time to learn the litle needed to asemble a decent box. List how you use your computer now and what you'd like to do in the future. If you decide that video editing might be nice you can include a DVD burner. The plus to doing it yourself is that you can install a dual layer burner at a reasonable cost along with an inexpensive DVDROM drive. These aren't features you will see in mid priced systems but can be included for about $100. Since DVD burners also will burn CDs that's covered also. Or you can do like I did in one box, use a motherbaord with built in raid, have a CDROM, a CDRW, a DVDROM and a dual layer DVD burner. Plus two hard drives. Overkill? You bet but fun to make and use. And I've yet to see a comsumer level computer with those features.
Kenny, I've got 4 now networked in here, 2 in the other room and have built 2 for friends. BUT I started by building ONE because like you I wanted to upgrade.
Personal exp. on making the error of " Not " Building!
by WildeRiver - 4/22/05 9:18 PM In reply to: 4/22/05 Should I buy or build a computer? by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
Build your own machine. That way you can modift it at any time. Ready
built CPU's are mostly proprietary. They may put a good machine
together, but to fix it is not an option. It's all their hardware and
you have to get it from them. How much does that cost.
Example;
I bought my wife a Compaq laptop. The DVD/RW fried.
$350. to replace it with the compaq product that works with the system.
So her laptop is sitting in the closet gathering dust.
Lots of good parts though for someone with one that needs anything
excypt the DVD/RW.
Dave
Buy or build - an intermediate solution.....
by MikeG55 - 4/22/05 9:43 PM In reply to: 4/22/05 Should I buy or build a computer? by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
There is a half way solution to this question that has worked well for me in the past. I study what are the coming trends and latest hot items and then have a professional system integrator put it all together for me based on my wish list. I had 2 systems assembled like this so far and each time came up with my dream killer machine. Upgrading is also a cinch if you return to the same company. This is not the lowest cost route to your dream machine, but you get a nicely integrated system, no hassle and a guarantee.
Cheaper, Faster, Better
by Batese - 4/22/05 9:52 PM In reply to: 4/22/05 Should I buy or build a computer? by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
Woah there buddy. Homebuilt systems are often a LOT cheaper than off the shelf models. Granted, you can't match the low end cost of $399 for the cheapest Compaq without making some serious sacrifices...but on the other hand, why would you want the worst available model that money can buy. I put my personal system together for about $900 and it runs Doom 3 at the highest resolution with no problems. It takes about 30 minutes tops to put together a PC...literally, the hardest part is plugging in the Hard Drive and Power LEDS(They've got stupidly small plugs)...and about 40 minutes to install windows (but you can't leave during the installation because halfway through it those obnoxious little boxes with "Please Choose what Time Zone you're in" show up GRRR). James is VERY right about doing research on what components you want...but it's important to remember that if you are torn between ATI and Nvidia in the Video card wars, or Intel and AMD in the processor wars...CHOOSE THE CHEAPER ONE...there really isn't much of a difference either way performance-wise (Intel is ridiculously overpriced).
Luckily, homebuilt computers are about a million times more stable than off the shelf ones. I CANNOT count the number of Compaqs and HPs that I have had to service. Plus the HOURS of being on Hold for customer support. With a home-built computer each component comes with a seperate warranty (overall I've got a 4 year warranty on my computer, and a lifetime warranty on my videocard), this means that the time on hold for component repair or questions is cut down drastically.
Of course, if you REALLY don't feel comfortable putting together a computer, then the choice is obviously to buy an off the shelf model. If you ARE interested, don't let people scare you away...check out some websites about assembling personal computers...it's really quite easy, I promise.
oh...and ALWAYS work in a reasonably static free environment (ie: don't put your motherboard on the carpet)
Best of Luck,
Edmund
P.S. www.newegg.com and www.tigerdirect.com sometimes have great deals on barebones kits (basically a processor, motherboard, and case bundle)
Build Your Own
by dweave - 4/22/05 10:11 PM In reply to: 4/22/05 Should I buy or build a computer? by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
Hello Kenny, if you can afford it build your own. I built this one that I'm on now and have had no problems what so ever. James is right; you will have the satisfaction of knowing that you built it, plus what’s in it. The motherboards today are so easy to install and setup is pretty much automatic, depending on what mother board you use. I myself prefer Asus Boards. But there are other good boards out there too.
The system I built is an Intel 3 Gig over clocked to 3.6 with no overheating problems. I have an Asus P4C800 Deluxe motherboard w/800 front side bus. One gig of DDR memory expandable to 4 gigs. One 240 Gig WD hard drive and one WD 80 Gig hard drive, both formatted for NTFS. One Sony Optical Drive CD-RW and one Sony DVD- drive. Both are 52 x 32 x 52 x (16 for the DVD Drive). Two Sony floppy drives (really not needed). NVIDIA GeForce 6800 AGP Video Card: SoundBlaster Audigy2 ZS Sound Card, and other things that I already had. My case is an Enermax with an Antec True Blue 500 Watt Power supply. The system has 8 fans and believe it or not, it runs real quite.
I bought the Enermax case and fans first. I looked at a lot of cases because I knew I would be expanding later on down the line, so I wanted a case with lots of room and space for lot of cooling. The case came with a 350-watt power supply so I opted to change it to the 500 watt Antec. Don’t skimp on Power! There is an adapter you can buy to test your power supply once it is installed into the case. I then bought the Asus motherboard and installed it. That was a snap! After that I bought the entire items above one Saturday evening and in about four hours on Sunday I was up and running (without my OS installed of coarse). Yes, I placed the Asus CD in the drive and pushed the button and WALA, the program did all the set-up work for me after answering a few questions, and when it was done it took me to the C:\ prompt. All that was left was to install my OS and software. Cost was just above $ 3,000.
Yes to me it was worth it! I know what’s in this case and I put it together. What’s nice about building your own are the thinks you can do to it to make it even faster, over clocking for instance. Buying an already built system is fine, there are some nice systems out there, but if you like to tweak the motherboard settings you are limited on what you can do. And certainly forget about over clocking your CPU chip and changing core voltages. Of coarse if you buy a high-end system (Alienware, Polywell, Uspowerpc, ect.) then you can do those things, so why not build your own because the price on high-end systems are not cheap. It’s all up to you on what you want, but the bottom line is satisfaction and knowing you and only you, built it.
Good Luck!
Don
dcweave@msn.com
Buy or Build Computer
by RoeMaier - 4/22/05 11:38 PM In reply to: 4/22/05 Should I buy or build a computer? by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
I would like to add to the article by James S. Remember you must come up with an OS if you build. Windows XP SP2 $136 +shp search google, I don't know whether CNET has a price grabber. this would be a good time to learn Linux.
I am now building my second photo and video computer lotsa memory 4 512MB, gives 2GB for a board with 4 DEMM sockets. Lotsa hard drive,4 250GB RAID 0 instead of mirroring store it twice. RAID 3 would be better but I can't find a card. Video files from Studio 8 can be 20GB for Hi8 capture. You will need a separate hard drive for your OS. If you can afford multiple monitors, you will need 5 or 6 PCI sockets. I sometimes can get two monitors per card.
Read the above, say to yourself 'that's not me' and buy
one or some places have Built To Order (BTO)
Not so fast...
by PwrSurge - 4/22/05 11:50 PM In reply to: 4/22/05 Should I buy or build a computer? by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
Sorry James, buy your reply is mostly incorrect. IF you are looking to buy some Yohama mama system to surf the internet, read email and do word processing, then buy some budget end PC from Walmart (I bought my mom one, set it up and I've not heard a single complaint from her).
If you want a sweet system, then you will save a LOT of money building it yourself. Last February I built my AMD64 3400+ PC with 1ghz RAM, a 250MB SATA harddrive, 256MB Radeon 9800xt, a DVD burner, and a DVD player for around $1,600.
And while you probably can't find an off-the-shelf system that meets all your desires, you can easily buy high end systems configured to your minutest detail on the better sites.
If you do build your own PC, you need to start out by figuring what type of CPU you want to run and then finding a good mobo to support it. The rest of your choices will slightly depend on your mobo, but most modern mobos will support pretty much any hardware you buy. You can easily get OEM windows when you purchase hardware from an online site, so that's no problem.
So, low end PC, buy it from Walmart. High end PC, you can easily configure and buy one online, but you'll save much money doing it yourself. But, if you don't know what you're doing, you may want to skip building it yourself as you'd have to be a special kind of stupid to experiment with high end components.
If you want to buy a customized system online, I would recommend the following site for good customization, good pricing, and consistently good reviews on its systems:
http://www.buyabs.com/
Here are some good sites if you want to go the build-it-yourself route:
http://www.anandtech.com/
http://www.trustedreviews.com/index.aspx
http://www.accupc.com/AccuPC/WebStore/
http://www2.newegg.com/index.asp
And, of course, cnet.com
The devil is in the details! Response to buy or build
by dony - 4/22/05 11:54 PM In reply to: 4/22/05 Should I buy or build a computer? by Lee Koo (ADMIN)
Sorry but I hate any answer that begins with: "The short answer is..." because it is usually a generalization and glosses over the options. James, with all due respect, I think you are misleading folks here.
I agree that OEM off-the-shelf builders buy trainloads of components. However, what makes anyone think that they are passing the savings on to the consumer? As well, unless you are willing to pay the premium prices some first tier manufacturers charge, you will likely get substandard, dated components that are also often hardwired together to cut costs. Motherboards are limited and systems cannot be easily expanded or improved.
All that testing and assembly costs money and that cost is passed on to the consumer.
I also have about 30 great parts stores within a few miles of my home. When I want to build, I determine the system I want, look at the price of the components I want on the net, write a list of which parts I will buy at which retailer and then do one two-hour pick up run. The computer builds in about 1.5 hours, software loads in another 1.5 hour and I tweak it for another hour. I test with SiSoftware Sandra and beat the crap out of the boxed systems.
I rarely use the drivers that come with any hardware or system because they are always out of date. So I load fresh and current drivers from the net.
I build 3 - 6 systems per year for myself, my family and close friends and beat the shelf price every time while getting an absolutely better machine. No, there are no problems and yes I do have warantees on all parts. I have never yet had a new part fail.
No, I am not an engineer or a computer geek. I am a businessman with no training in computers. All it took was a short trip to Tomshardware and a few other sites, an interest in the most current hardware/software and the courage to just do it.
As an example of how the big boys work, we buy a large number of Compaq/HP products at work and these are always one season old before we even see them. This means they are effectively obsolete when we buy them. These are the same units sold at a premium price through stores.
We need more examples. So, I built a 64 bit 3500 AMT (punched to 3800) with 2 GB of ram, fast SATA drives in raid (striping) configuration and an ATI video card that is just under the really expensive ones. I could not find anything like this on the shelf and the price to have one custom built was twice my cost. I even treated myself to a nice blue and red light Sidewinder case with transparent side. Oh yes, so why the speed?
I process raw Canon files through to finished photos. I will typically run through 150 - 300 X 47MB raw files to deliver 100 finished photos. Sometimes, I can run as many as 600 files through immediately because the photos are needed. Because I also manipulate and res up some of the photos, I am really pushing my system to the wall. I also do video and this unit never drops a frame.
As an example of tier one manufactures using inferior parts, I will use my own laptop. The Compaq 3140 laptop with 64 bit AMD, 512 MB of ram and a lousy Fujitsu hard drive is an example of large tier one manufacturers using substandard parts. This hard drive runs at about 4200 rpm and has noise supressing software that knocks it down by another fifteen per cent. I replaced mine with a Hitachi 7200 rpm drive with 8MB buffer (less than five minutes from start to finish) and the impact using Photoshop is tremendous. I cannot upgrade the motherboard or increase the ram beyond 2GB so this computer will become a boat anchor over time.
Don
| Forum legend: | |
 |
Locked thread |
 |
Moderator |
 |
CNET staff |
 |
Samsung staff |
 |
Norton Authorized Support team |
 |
AVG staff |
 |
Windows Outreach team |
 |
Dell staff |
 |
Intel staff |
